i am enraged
•
by alfred temple
i know this is hardly the place to vent my anger over MY country in RL's healthcare reforms but i will none the less.
I am deeply concerned over the proposed healthcare reforms. I find it scary that we as a country are going down the track of socialized medicine and general socialism as a country in general. From my knowledge socialism is the first step on the disastrous trail to communism. I do not understand how a country that’s debt is over $9,000,000,000,000 can possibly afford to finance an operation as large as the one proposed. With an existing shortage of doctors there will only be longer lines resulting in a lower quality of care for all of us. Another problem is priority care in which younger patients will get priority over older ones regardless of who can pay. I don’t want my grandparents dropping dead because they can’t get care and I don’t think that I want the government coming between me and my doctor, because people will be forced onto a government plan which if this bill passes is what will inevitably happen.
I am also mortified due to the actions of our representatives in congress, the senate and our president. They alone are making trying to rush this bill as fast as they can in order to prevent us, their constituents from having a voice in the discussion. The proposed four bills are each all over 1000 pages long and it is doubtful that each representative would be able to read the bill in its entirety when the president is trying to rush it through. They know that the majority of Americans oppose these reforms and frankly most Americans are happy with their coverage, yet many representatives continue to support it.
Every time I turn around I hear news that is contradictory to something I’ve already heard, and I find myself very confused. All I want is to know is the truth but it seems as if no one really wants to tell it. What America needs is at the next chance to vote out of office every incumbent, republican or democrat and get people in there who are actually willing to help this country and stay true to what our founders first said in the constitution, bill of rights and declaration of independence. They laid down a set of principles that we cannot just ignore, they have led this country to greatness and if we stand by them even in the darkest of times our nation will continue to prosper as it always has, “one nation under god with liberty and justice for all”.
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You are completely right, the USA is the only right minded country in the world. It has been perfect over the last decade, and there is no reason the change something perfect.
agreed!!! we are the only country that will always take a stand for freedom, yet never make a mistake!
Socialized healthcare in Europe is thriving Alfred Temple. There is absolutely no good argument for why healthcare run by the private market is any good for the consumer. In fact I think its quite clear that its not, public health is shit in the states compared to Europe. And that's despite the fact that we smoke more and if you look at parts of England, eat fattier foods.
I'm mortified that the American media is confusing the issue by making up lies about healthcare in Europe, I am mortified that people believe that free market competition means better healthcare for you (that makes no goddamn sense), I am mortified that you are bringing up the constitution and the bill of rights in a debate about healthcare. Are you stupid? How are these things even related?
Your doctor problem is not a problem at all. In fact public healthcare will increase the use of preventive medicine (as it will be affordable) meaning that there will be a drop in need for acute medical treatment.
Also, your debt is irrelevant. Your debtors won't call in that debt unless they want to ruin themselves. However it would've been far smarter to invest in healthcare instead of investing in experimental military technology that doesn't work.
Its just the line myth that bothers me. I've been to doctors in both the states and in Denmark. In the states you always have to wait for a doctor. In Denmark you don't. And we have a doctor shortage too.
this was obviously ment for the american media but I have to make a general comment anyway.
Alfred Temple wtf are you doing in a virtual country which is a mirror image of the social democratic state of Denmark in the real world? No matter how you look at it, even the rightwing liberals of denmark are extreme leftwing when compared to american politics. What is it you love so much about denmark when you feel the need to express such a hatred for the socialism that has contributed tremendously to shape the scandinavian countries what they are today. You seem to be unable to disinguish between socialism and communism. No not even communism, which is probably the greatest ideology ever in theory but never worked IRL due to the greed of individuals. No you consider socialism and stalinism as equal. you hail the true freedom loving country of USA, while forgetting that you FORCE other countries into democracy. You did not give them the freedom to choose themselves. Your country also supported rightwing fascist leaders and military coups in the south american countries when the governments there got too left wing and stopped obeying orders. Your country which you claim "will always take a stand for freedom" is in truth to a large degree the most oppressing country of the world as it is atm. But I guess Fox News doesn't tell that side of the story.
Really. I do not understand what it is you want in Denmark when you feel like this.
Grev Per I salute you for your comment. I first tried writing something like that but I couldn't find words.
This is a pure guess but I estimate 95% of europeans would rather have european public healthcare than the private system you have in the states.
Well when you don't define socialism you're just going to have a circular conversation. Socialism is the stage a nation takes on the path to achieve communism. Socialized benefits such as healthcare or free education are an aspect of social democracy, or a capitalist state with socialized benefits, not a socialist state by any means.
Og altså venstre er broderpartiet til Demokraterne, jeg vil ikke sige at de er ekstremt venstreorienteret. Man kunne faktisk sige at Republikanerne på nogen planer er mere progressiv end de konservativ, f.eks mht immigration og integration. Retten til at blive, mm.
I think if you cut the bull and were able to talk to any American individually they would agree that free healthcare is preferable. When people confuse the issue by bringing in civil rights, death panels, lies etc., you can end up scaring the crap out of people. Especially the elderly who are the biggest voting group and who are well covered by Medicare. (so the biggest group of voters doesn't need healthcare, is easily scared and public healthcare could be made to seem a threat).
I just don't understand how someone can argue against having a comprehensive and free healthcare system. How can that be bad?
The united states spends more per capita than any other country in the world and yet there are still 30million americans without health insurance and therefore with limited access to care. In life no matter how bad things get ppeople say "well at least i have my health", i dont see why anyone would take something so basic away from someone else. Its a selfish act, people can easily rebel and complain about something when they have it, come to me if god forbid your family is going bankrupt because of the costs of cancer treatmen et al.
Heh Per my reasoning was that if Alfred can call USA a nation that stands up for freedom nomatter what, then i can call Denmark a socialist state. I know were not truly socialist, and we are properly moving away from it, but nonetheless we are fairly soialist compared to the US as far as i know I do realise however that you are the expert on the subject having lived in both countries 😛
Mht. at venstre og demokraterne er søsterpartier så ja, men på en lang række områder vil jeg da kalde venstre mere progressive. Venstre er f.eks. (som resten af danmark) meget liberale mht abort, hvilket så vidt jeg ved stadig bliver diskuteret ivrigt internt i demokraterne? udlændinge politiken er svær at sammenligne da USA er et land skabt af indvandrerer. men greencard regler og bare tilladelsen til at komme ind i landet nu om dage er vel næsten lige så svær at få som asyl i Danmark.
En direkte sammenligning af demokraterne og et dansk parti er jo svært. I et toparti system begge partierne fungere som et paraply-organization for en række gruppe, i stedenfor den danske interesse-baserede system hvilket fungere på et mere ekslusiv plan.
Dvs. venstrefløjen af demokraterne kunne være så venstre som SF eller socialdemokraterne, hvorimod højrefløjen kunne overgå de konservativ.
I like that alfred temple is the embodiment of all the elements of the US that the rest of the world despises.
-keep up the good work alfred temple, once again the americans proves that our stereotypes of you for the most part are absolutely correct. Your ignorance makes me lol, you under-educated Reagan loving throwback.
Ugh and I'm tired of stupid trolling comments like that.
Y'all Niggers posting in a troll thread.
ok i don't get what you guys are saying we as a nation with over $9,000,000,000,000 in debt and a massive deficit cannot afford to give 30 million people heathcare!!!
and @hoemarx , yes i am the steriotypical american redneck and proud of it, cause at least i'm not a commie/progressive/socialist pussy like you!
Jeg er Amerikansk, or er meget, meget ked af alle negative snakke om hvors [healthcare]. Mennesker i alle andre land er meget glade og herhenne er mange some kan ikke se doktor. Mange af dem med [insurance] ville finde de har det ikke nar de blive rigtig darligt
Men Fox News et all sige "det er socialistic" og mange, mange mennesker taenke det er rigtig. Jeg laese paa danske fordi jef har skrivet om disse meget, meget i andre forum (andre sted) og will ikke gerne i inanden. Jeg vill nu var sige tak till all dansk som har snakket om det og om deres system.
One thing Hoemarx.. though I agree with your sentiment, Reagan was a saint compared to [name withheld to keep discussion civil]
reagan was a saint! he ended the cold war.
The most progressive and perfect system was that of ancient greek city states. If you disliked the politics of one polis, you could go to another one, and still be among your kinsmen. You had Athenian democracy, Spartan egalitarism and many more systems within one nation. If you couldnt fit in any of these, you could always live in wilderness (chaos), which was the vast space between those states. There, you are free to do what you like, because cities didnt have control over that space. I dont belive in todays huge national states, and national politics whether they are left, center or right wing. One`s freedom shouldnt be limited by the political choice of the whole nation.
Sounds terrible Elesid.
And one man can't end the cold war. I think the Soviet Union's collapse was probably due much more significantly to affairs in Russia, rather than Reagan's tough talk.
As for the debt, again Alfred that's irrelevant.
i dont know what is so terrible there, that is the only way to have some freedom. By the way, it is empirically proven that smaller systems are functioning better than huge ones. There was one more thing that made this system superior: the criminals were simply banished from polis, with no need to execute them or filling the jails with them. Today, you cant banish your own citizen, and you are sentenced to bear him as a burden. If you cant fit in the system, you just find another one. If you cant fit to any of them, go to unoccupied territory, and with some luck and knowledge you may even build one.
How can you empirically prove that?
You know what's great about this system? We don't shove our criminals down the throats of other nations, nor do we receive theirs. Also government programs to aid the poor, educate the young, maintain law and order. There are a myriad of reasons why I'd rather live in Denmark than ancient Greece.
Oh and we don't have slaves.
Elesid - You got something completely wrong here. Greece was not a nation in the ancient time. Sparta was a nation, Athen was a nation, Thermon was a nation.
Yes, they had close ties, but they was not under the same banner. Just look at the wars of Sparta vs. Athens.
wrong again. They were a nation, but with many rulers. War between Athens and Sparta existed ofcourse, and many more other wars between polises, but that doesnt mean they werent a nation. Those were clashes between rulers for power. You had many civil wars in modern era within one nation too. The Greeks were nationally concious despite their internal clashes. In the age of Peloponesian wars, they all referred to themselves as Hellenes, with the same language and cultural heritage. Even in the age of Troyan war, they called themselves Danaeans, which is the name of the whole nation even though they had more than 50 kingdoms involved in that war. Terms such as Hellenes, Danaeans, Greeks, repeat countless times in ancient literature. Even Alexander I of Macedon declared himself as a Greek during the Persian wars.
And for Grev Per:
I wasnt talking about Danish system, i was talking about all political systems today. Denmark certainly has one of the best few systems today. But i just dont agree with the national states, because of many different opinions and movements in such a huge system. I cannot agree with that the every last peace of dry land is someones or some state`s property. I cannot agree that freaking bottled water companies own all water springs in one country. In my opinion, that is an inadmissible outrage.
And yes, sooner or later we shall all be slaves.