[MoF] over CO betalingen / on CO payments
Day 2,112, 03:22
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Published in Netherlands 
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by
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by Ministerie van Economische Zak
ENGLISH BELOW
MoF over Combat Orders
Als MoF ben ik een aantal zaken aan het onderzoeken over de Combat Orders in combinatie met onze Communes. Een van de onderdelen daarvan kan iedereen helpen bij het kiezen van de juiste gevechten als er Combat Orders zijn. In de onderstaande tabel vind ja van onze staats MU’s en PG per speler diverse gegevens. In de kolom ‘CO Payment’ zie je voor elke speler het bedrag wat een Combat Order moet opleveren per miljoen damage om voor je tankgebruik kostenneutraal te vechten. Daarbij ga ik uit van een prijs per tank van 11cc. Ontvang je meer kun je dus winst maken en ontvang je minder dan kost het je (een beetje) geld als je tanks moet aanschaffen. Spelers die zich afvragen waarom ze niet in de lijst voorkomen; Dan ben je geen onderdeel van een staats MU (of PG die ik in dit geval ook meegenomen heb). Als je in de toekomst dus ook dit soort informatie wilt moet je dus toe treden tot een staats MU. Ben je wel lid en je staat er toch niet bij? Dan staan je gegevens niet in egov4you en zal je daar dus eerst voor moeten zorgen.
© Weekstrom
Minister van Financiën
[ENGLISH VERSION]
MoF on Combat Orders
As MoF I’m investigating a few matters about Combat Orders and our Communes. One of those things can help anybody to make the right choice when it comes to fighting if there are Combat Orders. In the table below you’ll find data about players in our state MU’s and PG. In the column ‘CO Payment’ you can see for any player the amount of payment needed per million damage done by a Combat Order to let that player fight without having costs for tanks given a price per tank of 11cc. If you get more you can make a profit, do you get less it’ll cost you (a bit) of money if you have to buy tanks. Players that are wondering why they aren’t listed; You then are no member of a state MU (or PG that on this occasion was analysed as well). So if you want to make sure you will get this kind of info in the future you should join a state MU. If you are a member and still not listed? Then you’re data isn’t recorded with egov4you so make sure it is.
© Weekstrom
Minister of Finance
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Comments
Nice to see. Will make it easier for people to see when they make a loss and when a profit.
Very good information and nice to see the tactic I adopted gives nice results.
What I do wonder however; Why didn't MOD do this? I barely hear/see anything from them besides from some standard information. Extra stuff/new things to work with don't come from them.
First the Guerilla Fights that had to come from ElGorro, now this from the MOF. At least that's still part of gov...
Would be nice if MOD took some more responsibility if you ask me.
These tables clearly show the importance of strength. It seems like you sorted the table by CO payment ascending, but this almost gives the same results as strength descending.
Another important factor for Combat Orders is the division. If you're in a lower division, typically countries are willing to pay more for your division. The average CO payment needed to make a profit in your division gives an indication how well you're doing. If you need more to make a profit, you should focus more on your strength.
Especially for the lower divisions actively seeking out Combat Orders might seem tempting. On the short term you can make a large profit (if your strength is good). But beware: fighting will also grant you experience point, causing you to go to a higher division. And also, Combat Orders only award money if the wall is below a certain percentage, typically 51%. While you're fighting it may cross that limit, and you won't be awarded any money for that kill.
So, I advice you to remember that tomorrow you'll have a higher strength than today, and will therefore also make a bigger profit on Combat Orders if you wait...
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Actually I took dmg/hit. But that's the basis for CO cost. And indeed strengths is the most important although in lower div rank does have a relatively high impact. If you get to the higher div's (or better; Strength) the relative influence of rank gets lower since strength grows linear while rank points needed for the next ranklevel is progressively increasing.
Is it strange that I haven't got a clue what this is about and that I don't particularly care what this is about because I play for fun and doing numbers is not one of my talents?
find your name and read the column that says CO payment. If you find a CO that gives more than that amount, you make a profit (incl buying your Q7 at 11 cc)
So in your case it says 66.61 NLG/million influence.
I've never seen Combat Orders rewarding that much in division 4...
So probably this means you should work mainly on getting a higher strength, and disregard combat orders for now, since they're only costing you money (at least with Q7)...
Doing combat orders with food fights should be fine, since you are already in div 4, and I don't think there ever will be a division 5.
Really, I already fought for battles were I could get 200cc for a million in D4 😃 I trew some small bombs on them. But maybe that because those CO's were only available for the USA.
I guess hose were indeed US only orders. Probably a way to supply their own soldiers?
ST6 is working that way now AFAIK indeed.
It wasn't an CO from ST6. As I can remember from an MU of Peru.
I don't think a MU could bring up 200CC/mill for division 4. For most members 40-50 will be enough to buy Q7 weapons, so they'll just stop there.
If there are such extreme (>100 CC/mill) offers for D4, they must've been desperate for damage. I don't think they've targeted US soldiers specifically in that case. But it must have cost them a fortune, probably with relatively little gain. Maybe it was a mistake?
It was a crucial battle I thougt, not sure anymore 😛. Was last 10 minutes of the last round if they won D4 they had won the battle otherwise they had lost the battle. But 200 is still epic 😛. Think it was mistake too
I haven't seen Q7 being sold for 11 cc in ages so that's a moot point anyway. As for CO's costing money, that may be so but every fight for the next merc medal cost money and if I can compensate that with CO money, even if it's just a little, it helps.
perhaps its just me, but merc medal is not a good investment.
Hunting for merc is indeed a very bad investment; 50 times 25 kills. Say on avg 2,5 hits per kill then you'll need 3.125 hits or 312,5 tanks. If they would cost you 10cc a piece that's 3.125cc, while 5 gold gives you 1.080cc. So you will loose lots of money pursuing merc. You should only see it as an extra reward and perhaps hunt for it if you have 5 countries to go or so.
It might help a lot more if you saved your tanks and gold to upgrade you're traininggrounds frankie so you can train fully. You're strength is really low while you're xp and rank are relatively high. So you fight/work a lot but are ineffective. That's also visible in other stats; You're nr 24 on xp in eNL, strength 41 and on medals even nr 53.
Suppose I spend what little gold I have (3.39 to be exact) on training - another training ground upgrade is clearly totally out of reach. I'll run out of gold within 4 days so I can't buy food and weapons anymore. This means that I'll have to cut down on fighting so my next merc gold takes a lot longer to earn. In other words, I'll get ahead even slower than I do now. So this is your advice?
Yes it is. Read my previous advise plus the one linked to in there. It works perfect for me (and yes I did buy some gold once to be able to upgrade to Q4 all 4 as it was immediately clear to me that would be key) but the guys I'm coaching all do the same and don't buy gold, yet don't lack resources but all are almost on the point of being able to upgrade to Q4 and start full training. And they are all way of div 4 so have loads of opportunities to earn extra BH medals. Or mercs.
to be clear; the advice in my previous article. Link can be found under the article above.
Even if I take advantage of the occasional 30% off that still means 200 gold to upgrade the last 2 training centers to the max. With earning only 5 hardworkers gold every month (because there won't be any merc gold anymore) that takes 40 months - that is 3 years and 4 months. I don't think i'll be around that long...
Really? I must be doing something wrong then; I'm 10 months old, have 2 trainingcentres at max, enough gold to max the third if the discount comes. According to you're calculation I must be 5 years old then as that did cost me 300 gold?
The latter is correct of course, but with 65 medals that's no issue although the BH medals were only 2 gold. You have 118 and thus should have (used) almost 600 gold. 4 trainingcentres on max should not be a problem then. Ofc you used the gold already I suppose, but saving the gold from now on should give you the 2 last centres at max a lot sooner than you calculated.
You joined in a different time. When I joined there was no training or coaching and information on how to play the game the best way was scarce. So I made a lot of costly mistakes that you didn't have to make. That has changed considerably and also the game itself has changed so there is no good comparison. Also, we're in different divisions and that makes a difference too considering earning options.
I know Frankie. That time was different indeed. The gold you earned for example was worth way more then it is nowadays. On the other hand; resources were more expensive as well., But no matter what time you started; Training would always have been key so when that changed I feel people should have adapted and use other tactics to play the game. That's, to me, one of the challenges in a game; Look what fits best.
This is an amazing article, really well done.
Very interesting analysis!
A seconday benefit of this table is that we can know, exactly, how much damage Dutch soldiers can inflict on a battle on a baseline of 550 food fights per soldier... Just need to multiply dmg/hit Q7 by 110 and we get an accurate estimation of base damage that we can muster on a single period of half-day.
Absolutely ; -)
Although you do mean health ofc, that being 55ff while normally you have 50. I suppose you still have a temporary health centre in place atm.
AND we would need to know the amount of permanent health centres available for extra accuracy as that gives up to 300 extra health. Fully loaded I for example have 130ff available.
Although I would expect MoD to have that kind of data at their disposal I fear they have not. Best would be some sort of dynamic "Database" so you would copy the rough egov data in, add some formula's and have the new actual data available. Even excel works fine for that. The calculation of level and rank is very easy once you have a base table filled.
Why 50/55?
I'd assume 100, for full energy bar and full recovery.
In my case atm even 120 ff max (both a temporary and permanent 50 bonus energy center).
That's what I do; using 50ff as base and thus 100ff for full use. But Yfke was talking about 550 so I presume she has a temp 50+ active atm which led her to believe 55 is the base.
Great work! nice to see when fighting actually is profitable and when its just to get your DO 🙂
Is this going to be used to set COs as a replacement for communes?
Assuming the average is going to be used, then the people with the lowest strength will be getting less...
So an additional reason for everyone to mind their experience (in D1-D3), and work on getting a higher strength.
The question would then be, how much can we actually spend on COs according to our budget. I'm guessing this will not even be close to the break-even point. And actually we only want to supply until people have finished their DO.
Unknown yet. Don't think so as it will need to be a combination of several things to make things work.
And no, we're not even close indeed. We could afford one or two day's worth of CO battles.
I miss UNP ARMY hmm
Since when is UNP a state MU?
Since when is PG?
Is reading realy that hard? I'd think that small amount of text shouldn't be that hard to read...
Yes so? Why the one and not the other? I have read it all
relax guys. The way i read it its courtesy from the State to provide this report, with one time inclusion of a private MU that holds a large part of our community as well. Yes thats discriminations and yes thats to make this report more interesting. Anyway, thats how I read it.
Quite simple Kordak; I investigate things as gov official. So that's the state MU's. But as PG is quite large plus there are other things going on as well I did look at them as well. Other MU's were not. And as for UNP Army; You guys even fight against state orders and against eNL allies/friends so as long as that kind of things are going on I will not do anything that benefit's you're MU. A MU that not even has an eDutch commander. One could even wonder what's eDutch about UNP nowadays...
I always followed state orders from the mass PM, but you guys stopped giving them. Now we fight for common allies of eNL and eBE. And you do not see me as Dutch citizen? So the special status doesn't mean anything nowadays? I got accused of many things by the MoFA of eNL some weeks ago. To keep the peace I stopped fighting against ONE ALLY of eNL. But I was the only one fighting aganst them and the reason is simple. They lied to eNL and are no true allies, because they won't do anything to help us.
True, MoD didn't update orders frequently. Still isn't. But that's still no reason to fight against allies. Certainly not when you're the commander and to my knowledge had the DO against them as well. It's not up to you to decide if a country is trustworthy or not. If MoD tells you who to fight for you ought to comply. That's called chain of command and the basis of military. The way I see it you proved you're not fit for command. Can be a mistake of course but that's not up to me.
Special status or not is also not up to me to judge but the ones in charge made it clear to me there is more going on by throwing you out of the command line so there must be more going on. Its just some simple fact's that lead to the decision's made. Until that is cleared effort on UNP is out of the question and it will depend largely on the status UNP gets if there will be put effort on in the future.
UNP never had a DO against a single ally of eNetherlands, so judging based on that is not something you should concern in your function. When the MoFA of eNL asked me to stop fighting against this ally I listened. Also judging I'm not suited for commander is trowing mud in the face, something I'm not going to return to you. Typically someone in eNL who always insults others to legimate their own actions and failures. I only said that I missed UNP ARMY and when your people tried to explain their arguments were not strong enough to convinve me.
To make sure more people have a place in the eNL commune I supply my own MU with my own money, like vS does in PG. I have no hard feelings against anyone, but your response does deeply disappoint me.
Also I don't know anything more that should be going on? So that argument you use is incorrect. Please tell me who is in charge, so I could contact them to get this misunderstanding out of the world.
I really want to get some more questions, since I am still a member of the eNL congress as well.
If what you state is true then misleading information was spread among people that led to other / wrong conclusions as I base decisions on what is told or what I do know myself. If so I'm sorry. The conclusion that you're not fit for command is a result of that as well. (My definition; Someone in a command line that doesn't follow orders isn't fit for command. Although he/she could have reasons for it, if they are not explained/known it's hard to take that into account).
As for my response; The presented information is a spin-off for work I'm doing as a MoF. Adding extra MU's would mean extra work that would need to be done but what doesn't support the actual work I'm doing. If I would have loads of time perhaps I would have. Could be that it will be done in the future by MoD as this should be their line of business. I'm just investigating other matters as MoF but just thought it was useful to present it to a majority of the eDutch players.
And that you don't know about other matters going on is quite logical as you're not part of Gov or MoD or MoF who all three know of that.
I suppose you mean by the last sentence you want some questions answered in stead of receiving them. If you have specific questions; Send them by PM, preferably in Dutch, and perhaps I can answer them or take them into account a next time if it's easily achievable.