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[AMP] Have the Admins Gone too Far?

Day 1,882, 13:14 Published in USA USA by Israel Stevens

My fellow AMPers,

I don’t think it is a surprise to many of us that our party president primary was a hard fought and controversial affair. Many of us knew what was coming, and were not surprised by the turnout.

Let me start by saying two things, because they do pertain to the rest of the article. First off, congratulations to Haliman for winning the primary.
Secondly, I did not want Haliman to win. Not even a little bit. That’s important to say, because although I am against Haliman returning to leadership, I cannot sit quietly and watch while our forum admins completely subvert our party president.

We as a party elect our president. That person is tasked with leading us for a month, and their word is final. They have the ultimate authority in the party. If they abuse it, then we don’t elect them again. If they are a good leader, then we give them another month. But ultimately, they are the highest authority figure within the party.

But what has happened during the last month of emdoublgee’s second term, is inexcusable.

You may have noticed the high number of votes that were removed, then reinstated; as it was hard not to:

The forum admins went in, and unilaterally decided which votes should be counted, and which ones shouldn’t.

Jon Barack Bluejacket
Chase Mason Mikeals

All of those people had their votes removed. Take a look at those profiles, and tell me if you think they are multies.

I’ve known redbird for years. Spent a lot of time with him in the Army.
Jon Barack was one of the AMP’s best Congressmen for many months.
ollizu has been an AMPer almost as long as I have. Maybe even longer.
Chase M is up and coming.

But our forum admins have decided that it’s much better to repress the voting, than it is to do actual leg work and investigate why these accounts are coming up with the same IP address.
Have they never heard of roommates? Or husbands and wives? Or boyfriends and girlfriends?

When I saw all of the votes that were being suppressed, I sent a PM to our Party President:

Click image for a slightly larger view

As you can see, our admins went behind the Party President’s back and removed votes without his knowledge. He was not consulted, nor advised before this happened.

Although the votes were later reinstated, it was not without much needless frustration. It is not the job of our forum admins to suppress the votes without talking to the Party President first. Furthermore, our forum admins are there to serve the party, and by extension, the person that the party has chosen to lead us. They do not exist to make up the rules, or to interpret them. They exist to maintain the forum, and to investigate security matters at the behest of the party leadership. Or at the very least, to talk to party leadership before taking action.

This isn’t me being upset that my candidate lost. The votes we’re talking about were all for Haliman. I am upset that a party that bills itself as a home for everyone, is so quick to suppress votes. I thought we were better than that.

In their quest to stop multies, our admins have gone too far.

Our admins have also decided that going forward, they will dictate what candidates can and cannot publish in their articles:

One of the three admins, discussing the primary

At what point, does being an admin let you dictate rules to the party?

Protip: never.

And lastly, we all know that last month’s PotUS Primary was a bit of a cluster. What you may not have known, was the forum admin staff was off telling the candidates how many votes they were going to discount, without the Party President knowing. At this point, that seems to be standard stuff for our admins.

The two candidates knew more about the votes being removed than the Party President did.

This isn’t a reflection of emdoublegee. By all accounts, he’s been a phenomenal Party President. But it is hard to project power, when the forum staff is constantly running behind your back, playing silly political games for their own benefit/amusement.

This needs to stop.

I understand where the admin staff is coming from. And they do a lot of hard work maintaining the forums. Hats off to that, because it's something that is beyond me. But in their crusade for fair elections, they have gone too far.

Being an admin is an honor, not a right. You are trusted to safe keep our forum and our history. Not make rules as you see fit. You are trusted to obey the laws of the party, and to serve the party president, just as we all are.

I am very upset with our forum staff, and want to see immediate changes in the way they conduct themselves.


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emdoublegee Day 1,882, 13:28

Good article, I agree with you in most of your points.

However, I will say that the screenshot of my message on the forums was before we sat down and worked the data. Once me and the admins were able to sit down and dialogue, things were worked out pretty quickly. The work they do is stellar, and I applaud them for that! There just needs to be dialogue before decisions are made.

sumar82 Day 1,882, 13:52

excellent article

redbirdusa Day 1,882, 13:58

Thank you Israel, well said.

ligtreb Day 1,882, 14:36

Thank you for bringing this to our attention.

Those votes should have counted, and it's troubling to see these issues.

weasel2 Day 1,882, 14:57

The AMP primary votes like the WTP, non-secret votes. Doesn't the AMP have a list anywhere of who the members in good standing are?

Chucky Norris
Chucky Norris Day 1,882, 15:58

I have to hand it to you, I have had a momment of ''WTFBBQ'' when I saw all the votes that were removed.

I think that it's the first time that something like that happen. Maybe next time we will get better communication. I'm also surprised at how many renowned AMP member have been put in doubt during that time. I mean... anyone in the RT *should* have been able to see that these guys were legit. Dunno what happened there.

Mister Y
Mister Y Day 1,882, 16:28


Candor Day 1,882, 18:22

And so, a great article showing why Unity Primaries are completely untrustworthy and malleable.

This happens in every election, in every party. Admins screw with the voting. Usually it's done through access control. But too often, it's more blatant and direct like the example you've shown us.

That all said, seriously is there anyone who's played this game very long who actually has faith in honest election in forums?

Sorry, but they RARELY are truly honest. The best you can hope for is attempting to elect honest leaders. And sometimes a few will slip through.

John Largo
John Largo Day 1,882, 18:23

✯ ✯ ✯ Feel the AMPs ✯ ✯ ✯

Jon Barack Bluejacket
Jon Barack Bluejacket Day 1,882, 18:25


To me, one of the oddest things was that I didn't feel particularly strongly about the race I attempted to vote in.

But as a student of American History, I tend to be very sensitive to issues related to the right to have your vote counted.

Yeah, I know this is only a game.

I know this is not Selma, Alabama in 1963.

I know this is not Florida in 2000.

But as a RL American, and as a RL veteran, I do care about these things, even in a game.

Thanks to those of my friends who have assured me they believe I'm a real person, and not a cheater.

There's an old story about a man who was brought before the Court on a Criminal Charge. He spent the trial in jail. His business failed, his wife left him.

He won the trial.

His lawyer hugged him, enthusiastic, and said, "you're free! you must be thrilled!"

The man replied, "you're right. That's great. Now, where do I go to get my reputation back?"

Thedillpickl Day 1,882, 19:07

This is absolutely none of my business other than I'm a concerned citizen. I would like to point out a bit of Pickle's credo pertaining to the goings on here: "Respect is earned not given. Authority is a responsibility not a privilege." The whole mission statement can be seen here:

Captain Salty Kushskins
Captain Salty Kushskins Day 1,882, 19:54

Another reason why the meta-game sucks. Shame to see a great party like the AMP fall victim to such tactics.

Black Baroness
Black Baroness Day 1,882, 20:57

✯ ✯ ✯ Feel the AMPs ✯ ✯ ✯

Bia Pandora
Bia Pandora Day 1,883, 04:43

Remember those times people said I was crazy because I said forum votes could and would and were being screwed with.

Yeah. Right. Who's crazy now bitches. < That isn't a question.

Quintus Modius
Quintus Modius Day 1,883, 04:55

Down with the elites in AMP!

Glory to the people!
Glory to Nova Roma!

Pfeiffer. Day 1,883, 07:12

Watch your mouth, Candor. USWP doesn't have any problems with our primaries. We do at least two membership sweeps a month, and our polls can't be edited without logging into the server from the backend and directly manipulating data at the root level...which like, you'd need to be Pig or Blazix to know how to do without making the forum explode.

AMP uses a crappy free forum Haliman owns, and that's why they have issues. Also apparently they have crappy Admins.

Iliya The Great
Iliya The Great Day 1,883, 12:24

Candor x2

TTi09 Day 1,883, 12:48

Very good article IS

Drew Blood
Drew Blood Day 1,883, 15:51

'Watch your mouth, Candor. USWP doesn't have any problems with our primaries. We do at least two membership sweeps a month, and our polls can't be edited without logging into the server from the backend and directly manipulating data at the root level...which like, you'd need to be Pig or Blazix to know how to do without making the forum explode.'

Fluffer you are one to FN talk, you are the citizen who has 'Global Moderator' access and abuses that power by looking up citizens IP address so you can stalk them. Just so you know I own a Simple Machine Forum and it is also totally free, that software is no better or worse than any other free Forum; which makes me wonder why the hell money is collected on the eUS Forums. The USWP primaries are about as free as the the AFA primaries, your commenting to Candor is FN hilarious considering the USWP is the biggest offender when it come to election primaries; that plus the fact you blackmailed your way into the White House IMO means you need to shut your FN mouth.

Just so everyone knows, the only cost associated with running a forum like the eUS Forums is in the neighborhood of $10 a year for the domain name, after that is all elbow grease....

Viarizi Day 1,884, 04:20


Unbias Day 1,884, 12:21

I have to say, I am always impreessed by the way emdoublegee handles everything, I saw it and felt it first hand. Thats how I know. I am sure thats the first and only time something like that will happen.

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