Why? I will tell you why.
John A. Kelly
Rafale starts his whiny "Why?" article with a very weird question:
Rafale: Why are you always ruining our work?
Let's review the recent legislative action of the 1st Congressional Session (see http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=r3IPCTLFBTBScpqWjUt2_zw):
Of 10 Bills proposed by the RoE-EV (eHungarian) Parties, 7 were passed into law. The three Bills which were rejecte
😛
Bill 5904: "Do you agree with the proposal to issue 1000 EEK for 5 GOLD?"
Does anyone know why this was proposed when there was over 40,000EEK in the Treasury?
Bill 5896 "Do you agree to transfer 40000 EEK from the country accounts to Eesti Pank?"
Failed 18:18 but followed by the successful Bill 5940 proposed by Lantos (EV): Do you agree to transfer 45000 EEK from the country accounts to Eesti Pank?"
Bill 5674 "Do you agree to transfer 1000 GOLD from the country accounts to Bank of Estonia?"
This Bill is one of the Bank of Estonia vs Eesti Pank contests. Because Two other bills with the same language were defeated by the EV-RoE this Bill should be listed in the SDE column. See Bill 5549 proposed by s33vald(SDE/VIE) and Bill 5745 proposed by Alex Lawrence (SDE/VIE).
FICTION: The SDE/VIE and Estonians are obstructing (or "ruining") the legislative agenda of the EV-RoE parties.
FACT: The eHungarian parties have prevailed in 8 out of 9 legislative actions, and the last one is too weird to pay any attention.
Rafale: We try to help you, but you deny it always just because we are hungarian, this is so childish.
I could remind Rafale of the childish, slanderous, unbelievably dishonest propaganda from the eHungarian government and it's official agents in eEstonia (including Rafale). The media has be awash in claims like "I call the Hungarian congress members to remain in the Parliament, since there are still greedy foreigners in it!" and "For Romanian agents, please check your personal alerts: Killswitch is no longer a congress member. Alex Lawrence is no longer a congress member. And the list of them is still to be continued."
But there is another approach to Rafale's claim which demonstrates that the eHungarian bigotry against foreigners has harmed the functioning of the eEstonian government.
Let's look at the example of Bill 5795 and Bill 5917 "Citizen fee change from 10 EEK to 7 EEK":
Bill 5795 was proposed by Killswitch of the SDE/VIE and voted down.
Bill 5917 was proposed by Rommel Erwin of the RoE, and it passed.
Let's look at the example of Bill 5708 and Bill 5816 "Minimum wage change from 1 EEK to 1.5 EEK" and "Minimum wage change from 1.5 EEK to 1 EEK"
Bill 5708 was proposed by ri_csi of the EV and it passed.
Bill 5816 was proposed by Charles Martel of the SDE/VIE who successfully campaigned for it's passage. The Congressman's article Minimum wage. secured endorsements from The Syldavian Red Cross and Congressman Lantos (EV), two of the largest employers in eEstonia.
It is increasingly clear that RoE-EV congressmen can get any idiocy passed without debate, simply because of their loyalty to eHungary. If the SDE/VIE wants to pass a common-sense law, however, they must either campaign for it or convince a RoE-EV congressman to propose it.
Rafale: Can't you see that we try to help?
We can see that you've given 100 gold to the Government of eHungary. We can see that you've given 20 gold to a eHungarian diamond company. We can see that you've given 11 gold to an eIndonesian-controlled gift company.
We can see that you help your friends. Estonia? Not so much. We're still waiting to see the "low price" for a hospital and defense system. (Hopefully it's less than the +100gold-over market price that I've been reading about in the IRC channels.) edit: THIS is how it's supposed to be done: http://www.erepublik.com/en/forum/topic/95550/estonia-looking-for-cheap-q5-hospital/1
Rafale: If i like to i can run away with the money in every second, or maybe i have donated it to Citizen Cane who wanted to do a secret contract, but i didn't. The money is still here.
What contract did you sign with Reppalim Inc and LP's Company? Is it published in the Contracts forum? If you are threatening to "run away with the money" then why should we trust you with ANY of the money? It is precisely this attitude that caused the SDE/VIE to try to block donations to your Eesti Pank. (See Please stop playing this silly game by Rafale, and eHungary: Watch closely now. You own this. by John A. Kelly)
Never mind that. We gave you 200gold and several eHungarian congressmen donated their election awards but there is only 124 gold left in Eesti Pank. It is not truthful that "the money is still there" because 76gold is obviously NOT there. It is true that 62% of the money is still there. Should we dance for joy that 62% of the gold is still there?
Rafale: We agreed on the president too, there will be a RL estonian, what else do you like?
I would like transparency, honesty, integrity, debate, democracy, tolerance and good government.
Contested elections would be nice too. Let's pretend that this isn't a communist dictatorship where we have three parties but a foreign empire only allows us to vote for one candidate.
Rafale: Oh i know, you like to made us to go away. As i told you so many times before this is not a solution, try to cooperate or you'll ruin this country-not the hungarians, YOU the real estonian people will ruin if you always say no-.
Um. What can I say? This is probably the most arrogant, thoughtless, threatening piece of idiocy written in any eHungarian newspaper since the TO of eEstonia.
Here, the organizer of the TO for the eHungarian military has finally stopped saying "we're only here to help for a little while" and "we're just here to protect you from ATLANTIS" and is now saying "we're here and we're not leaving" and "we're here to protect you from yourselves."
Rafale: For example, there is the vote about the diamond's tax. Why is it bad for you? Can't you see that we don't have any diamond? Or you are a smuggler? If you are not, the answer is simple...
(1) a 1% import tax might be too low (maybe we should have a debate).
(2) The tax change will only benefit two companies, both of which Rafale has already gifted from the public treasury.
There are four gift companies in eEstonia: Estonian Gifts is smuggling via an the Indonesian-based "Estonian Gift org". Ultimate Gift is smuggling via an the Indonesian-based "Blue Whale". Oscaria Gifts is non-operational (zero employees and no job offers). S.Y.N.A.P.S.E. is owned by the eEstonian-based "Reppalim Inc", which received an 11gold gift from Eesti Pank earlier today.
There is one diamond company exporting to eEstonia: LP's Diamonds is owned by the Hungary-based "LP's Company", which received a 20 gold gift from Eesti Pank just yesterday (see Important for gift companies! by Rafale).
Rafale: Not every people is bad who talks english or hungarian, and if a people talking estonian it doesn't mean that (s)he is good.
Sorry, Rafale. You and your friends TOed a party and removed RL Estonians from the candidate lists. You then TOed the country and defeated RL Estonians with eHungrian candidates. You are now using the country's wealth to benefit yourself and your friends, which are the exact same crimes you accused other of planning. When you slandered those good people, you did so completely without any evidence to support your allegations. But you are not "every person" who speaks Hungarian: you are the one who has been spending the eEstonian treasury.
Now, you may claim that government subsidies for import licenses for favored businesses are a good idea and that government-run businesses are necessary. And, you may believe that it is right that the eHungarian government tell the people of eEstonia what to do, that eEstonia should send tribute to eHungary, and that eEstonians should be both silent and happy to be taken care of. But those ideas belong to communists and that relationship sounds a lot like RL Estonia's relationship with the USSR. In case you hadn't noticed, communists aren't particularly popular in eEstonia and the people would rather that their country be an independent democracy than a satellite of eHungary.
Comments
But as long as you're giving away money for export licenses...
Alex Lawrence would like 20gold to export Iron from 'Estonia Ironworks' (owned by Res Ipsa Loquitur) http://www.erepublik.com/en/organization/1344484" target="_blank">http://www.erepublik.com/en/organization[..]4484
John A. Kelly would like to be compensated for the 20gold used to buy an export license for oil from 'PetroZapata-Eesti' (owned by Eesti Riigipank) http://www.erepublik.com/en/organization/1446890" target="_blank">http://www.erepublik.com/en/organization[..]6890
Your right and I agree with the rebuttal. Did you get the message?
Nice Informative article VOTED!!!!!!!!
Voted.
People really need to open their eyes to see what's going on.
To give a single coin to a Romanian company... It will never happen.
There are many non-Atlantis companies who can also import iron to Estonia, we prefer them.
If you name a company "Estonia Ironworks" does not mean that it should have anything to do with Estonia.
regards,
tomhun
Voted, because some things correct, but some things are NOT.
"they must either campaign for it or convince a RoE-EV congressman to propose it"
That's how a real congress work. Try to convince the people about your idea!
And another misunderstanding, about the donations. I just want to COPY-PASTE our comment from Rafale's "Why?", what didn't get any answer:
"Reppalim, Inc. has received 11 gold from the official Estonian Bank, as a help from the state. This was the 50% of the company's funding cash, the other 50% was from Hungary. Now our company (S.Y.N.A.P.S.E.) is in Estonia, working for Estonians, occupies Estionans, pays Estonians, make gifts for Estonians, pay taxes to the Estonian government, etc, etc...
What's the problem then?"
Another thing. If you don't like Estonians ONE AND ONLY diamond importer, and you have problem that he received support from EP, then think a bit.. If that company withdraw from the Estonian market, tell me who would sell diamonds to Estonia???
Make yourself useful and get another company that wants to sell diamonds on the Estonian market! I'm sure that company would get the same state support...
this debate is ridiculous.. if your suspicion would be resonable and valid you should adress them to the congress members, and maybe you should propose bettes solutions
Alright, it finaly has been said 🙂
And before you start the "you are romanian" and etc etc ...
Mina olen eestlane ja räägin ka riigikeelt ja mis kõige toredam, ka sünnilt eestlane.
translate that! tomhun:
To give a single coin to a Romanian company... It will never happen.
There are many non-Atlantis companies who can also import iron to Estonia, we prefer them.
to take it simple;
We dont have the means and ability to choose ourselfs, all is desided for us.
As for the Reppalim Inc comment;
Why do you think that you are or will be the only one?
No other company in the world would import here ? no way - no how ?
I will say this again, I dont think that all the hungarians are "bad". Not by far.
But the actions and words of the few are what that matter.
An EXCELLENT article!!! Voted! Let's see what BULLSHIT will Rafale say about this.....
@Summy: I do NOT think we are the only one. As you can see there are 4 (four) companies in Estonia that sells gifts. I said that there are only 1 (one) company, what imports diamonds, what is the raw material for gifts. I just said that giving support for this company is a national interest, because if this company doesn't imports diamonds anymore, there will be NO (0, zero) gifts in Estonia.
I didn't say that there would be no other company, I said that at the present, there are no more. Just to quote myself: "get another company that wants to sell diamonds on the Estonian market! I'm sure that company would get the same state support..."
@Reppalim
But that comp has to be "peace friendly" ?
As tomhun sai😛 To give a single coin to a Romanian company... It will never happen.
Kind of "monopoly" there ?
No, it DOES NOT has to be, since Estonia is a neutral nation (I'm AGAINST the Hungarian TO). That was tomhun, this is me (Lord Saddalim). Please, do NOT generalize.
That was the most reasonable comment today 🙂
I salute you. At least your words are sincere 🙂
And why are you voted NO for this proposal?
http://www.erepublik.com/en/Estonia/law/6000" target="_blank">http://www.erepublik.com/en/Estonia/law/[..]6000
You need diamonds and you wan't decrease the import tax? I don't understand you.
Instinct
I have no idea who voted what. I havent voted on anything, as i am not in the congress.
But why most eEstonians are against eHun ?
Take a wild quess and let me give you a hint: TO!
It's ok that you are against this TO, but with this kind of resistance you are against your own country...
I (or I think WE!) just want to ask all eEstonians NOT to generalize. There are some eHungarians who came here for TO, and on the other hand there are some eHungarians who didn't came here for TO, just they've seen an opportinity in a new nation for their lives, companies.
You hate TOer eHungarians, just like us. But please, don't hate the non-TOer eHungarians!
(maybe these lines worth an article 😛)
I am against making estonia dependent on one force alone.
Like i pointed out, the tomhun's post.
Noone would get anything unless it's a "peace friendly". Whats that about ?
We (technicaly) are not in peace or alliance, so would'nt this be our dessision ? Apparently not.
@NanoTech:
I do not speak for the whole estonia.
@Repp:
I have nothing against non-TO'ers.
But sadly I cannot see what you or anyone else voted on the elections.
It is the actions of a few, that determine the opinion of a lot.
But it's good to hear that there are atleast some that are against that TO.
And I have nothing personaly against you 🙂
(switched to citizen account, this discussion is not about companies anymore 🙂 ) - Reppalim Inc = Lord Saddalim
I'm not in the congress, so I don't vote either 🙂 I wasn't even candidated, as I'm not a member of any party.
I think I write an article about this... what about continue there? 🙂
Summy: I'm afraid it would be naive to suppose the country can stay independent until it chooses a side... the ongoing war is really intense nowadays and for the powers capable of TOs every country is important... so all you can hope for that neither side will have any interest in Estonia at the next elections...
Anyway I read Hungarian TO policy, and I bet Atlantis countries have something similar. The truth is, like it or not the country is pretty much in the hands of superior powers good will
Saddalim:
yeah sorry about that 🙂 nothing against your comp 🙂
@Berengar:
I am aware of this all. And thats exaclty what am i saying.
But the fact is, that in these elections there was no atlantis TO attemt. If I am mistaken, please proove me wrong.
and back to Saddalim:
Sure thing, write it 🙂
well I arrived after the elections so hopefully that's already enough to prove my good intentions 🙂
anyway i don't know what happened that day. but as far as I know only the winners turn out to be TOers if you know what I mean. One can't tell what would be if not Hungarians and their allies were the majority of congress..
but after this chaotic period hopefully things will get clearer. I think the Hungarians who only came for TO have already left the country, the ones who stay will work for Estonia
1. I agree that there were some weird law proposals, i talked it over with my congress members, since this there are no proposals like these what you have mentioned.
2. And what if i help companies which are basically placed in other countries? They're still helping eEstonia, or why does it bad for you? If there is a volunteer who wants to set up a company here please write me, but the new, real estonians doesn't have enough money to set up a new company here, because there won't be profit, i think that's why i see real estonians in romania, and don't say that it's not true.
3. If you're still waiting for the hospital, do something for it, not just open a topic that we are searching hospital, because you didn't have the amount of gold for it. I heard so many times that everybody reported so many times that our 800 gold is lost, and okay i believed, but nothing happened.
Yesterday i decided that i'll look at the forums, what about our open letter, because they said that there were an open letter too, but...You won't get anything if you write this open letter in an article, remember this! You should open a topic for this problem and you should sign it with a lot of people. And an additional information, if you report something like that, report it in "CRITICAL".
I'm just wondering why the gold came back...
4. Ohh SgtMaj didn't mentioned what happened to your 100 gold? He told me that i have to donate it to the eMNB. So ask him in this case, don't look at me.
5. There will be contested elections, by Citizen Cane an italian person, but i don't think hat you should vote at him.
6. It's clear that you don't understand the taxes, sorry but i have to say that.
If you don't have raw materials, you need exporters, and exporters don't like high taxes...
Look around in the countries, and you'll see that i say it right.
I'm glad to see that not all eEstonians are against me just because I'm eHungarian. Thank you Summy 🙂
I wrote an article about what I'm thinking about eHungarians here, to summarize all these...
Rafale, you got point 😉
besides I can't say anything about 3,4,5 because I don't know anything about them
"To give a single coin to a Romanian company... It will never happen.
There are many non-Atlantis companies who can also import iron to Estonia, we prefer them.
If you name a company "Estonia Ironworks" does not mean that it should have anything to do with Estonia.
regards,
tomhun"
1. Estonia is neutral (or is supposed to be), and thus can trade with Romania or Hungary.
2. I currently employ 3 Estonians: Junction416, Porosus and Markus Lippus. They are training, getting their wellness up, and will eventually (as soon as a license is acquired) be producing iron almost exclusively for Estonia.
3. This company was created with Estonia in mind, so that Estonia's citizens and army can be prepared for the wars to come.
The majority of the funds needed to create this Q3 company came from my own pocket, with the rest coming from other Estonians, including SgtMaj.
What have YOU done, tomhun, that is comparable?
Couldn't have put it better myself. Voted.
I think tomhun's opinion is a personal one, it doesn't reflect the opinion of Hungarian born congressmembers, and doesn't help eEstonia's cause at all.
I also think we all can agree that this is eEstonia neither Hungary nor Romania so everyone who's willing to help Estonian people or economy is more than welcome.
PEACE IS JUST LIKE ATLANTIS. HUNGARIANS SAY THAT THERE IS A DIFFERENCE BUT TRULY THERE ISN'T.
Right pepsicoke so I'm a Hungarian and I don't state that Peace is any better than Atlantis. So can we all now work together for eEstonia?
I know but others do. I am not trying to generalize.
Yes hungarians is TO us, but now eHungary have no respect from eEstonians. Your attempt is Phyrros Victory!!! You can rob us , but now we know that we never accept ANYTHING that comes from eHungary. Is it clear to you?
Kapsaleht:
I think I can say it in the name of other Hungarians too: we don't really care what you would accept from Hungary in the future, as the ones who will stay here after the next elections will not stay to represent Hungarian interest in Estonia. Is it clear to you?
Yes, after you robbing us, you trying to rob other new country's from south-america, of course most of you leave eEstonia. I just say that when in RL Estonia and Hungary are friends, here your country respect here among eEstonians is ZERO. We dont do any business with you, any good relationship. NEVER.
We didn't rob you, can't you understand it?
I think Kapsaleht is getting a bit carried away.
Kapsaleht, sellistest sõnavõttudest pole meile eriti abi 😉 Süüdi ei ol emitte kogu eUngari riik kõigi oma asukatega, vaid need, kes tulid ja ennast meile siia etteotsa lasid hääletada ja nüüd majandavad nagu oma Pet Project'iga
Selling GOLD.
PM me.
(Also a big plus if you got STEAM, but only within few hours from now)