Innocent until Proven Guilty
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by Jeff Hamilton
It seems that some people will stop at nothing to get what they want. This is rendered quite clearly as I look at the current mess going on in Sol.
Sol is trying to impeach Albert Neurath, its Chairman for "Insulting citizens of Singapore, and behaving in a manner not condusive to the office of Chairman."
Many people will not know what I am speaking about because they do not know what has gone on in the secrecies of the Sol forums. I personally am not registered there, but I have had sources painstakingly piece together what has happened over the last few days. So far:
1. When Nagyzee was Chairman the expulsion of Pakistan was proposed because of the fact they let Serbia in to try and destroy China and India. The explusion vote was never taken because the forum admin was inactive, so the burden fell upon Albert Neurath, the new Chairman, to move it to discussion. The vote happens after the topic is moved, and it passes, 4 countries voting, three saying "Yes", and one abstaining.
2. Relorian, the former Advisory Representative of Singapore (that is VERY important at a later date), and current MoD, claims in a forum post that Albert Neurath is biased against Pakistan, and in favor of South Africa for not proposing their expulsion as well. This is ignored by all citizens.
3. On Saturday, Relorian, Flaco Jimenez (a private Singapore citizen), Boethiah (Singapore's Representative to Sol), and Nagyzee (one of two Sol Viziers) were in the #sol channel of the IRC. Relorian repeated his claim of bias against Albert Neurath, while Boethiah claimed that the vote to expel Pakistan was invalid because not enough member countries voted. That is, per the Sol Charter, a legal grey area.
4. Albert comes into the IRC, and Relorian starts taking potshots at him. For over an hour, the speech came something like this:
Relorian: Threatens to eLynch Albert. Calls Albert biased, incompetent, compares him to Hitler, accuses him of violating the Charter of Sol, and threatens to impeach him.
Boethiah: Accuses Albert of violating the Charter of Sol by passing through the Pakistan motion illegally.
Albert: Calls Relorian incompetent, expresses a wish to ban him from the forums (he did NOT know that Relorian was not an Advisory Rep at the time), and says that he is going to propose an amendment to the Charter to eliminate the grey area.
5. The thing rages onward. Nagyzee tries to calm everyone down, and proposes that they just retake the vote on expelling Pakistan. Albert Neurath agrees, and the thing seems to have started calming down. Albert Neurath learns that Relorian is NOT a Sol Advisory Representative, which means he could not have proposed an impeachment.
6. Garven Dreis, the ex-Sol Commander, comes into the room and mutes the room. He then proceeds to explain that the vote to expel Pakistan is valid because it has no requirement of the number of countries required to vote. Boethiah does not take kindly to this, and keeps repeating the same point over and over again. The discussion ends just around when the Singapore President, Whispering Elizabeth, comes in the room.
Ok, here's the fault tally so far:
Albert Neurath: Has asked for proof of wrongdoing, called Relorian incompetent, and wished he could have had him lose his Rep access that he SHOULD NOT HAVE HAD. Also has intepreted the Charter differently from Singapore
Singapore's government: Has compared someone to Adolf Hitler, called him incompetent, made graphic references to hanging him, threatened to impeach him, and interpreted the Charter differently from Albert and Garven Dreis.
Unbiased Opinion: Nothing impeachment-worthy so far on Albert's part. Relorian should not have had his Rep access remain available, and probably should not have opened his mouth in the first place. Boethiah has done relatively nothing so far, except fight a little with Garven.
Now onto stuff that I cannot tell you where I got it from:
Both sides retreat into their caves. Albert has started talking in a private (this is VERY important) channel. There, he expresses a desire to have Relorian banned from the forums again, and says that the only Singapore citizen he has a high opinion of is Chew-chew-shoe. This happened either DURING the fight in #sol, or RIGHT AFTER (within 10 minutes of the end of the fight.) He and Whispering Elizabeth then go off and talk for a while about things. The day ends.
DAY 2:
My sources check the forums, and see an impeachment proposal, proposed by Hekter of the Philippines (a former member of Albert's group who came in late to the fight and moderated it along with Garven). This is proposing impeachment for "Insulting citizens of singapore and behaving in a manner not condusive to the office of Chairman". They are basing this claim off of a private message between Albert Neurath and Boethiah, written BEFORE the large fight in which Albert says he thinks a vote will fail, and the log of the fight in #sol.
My Belief:
This whole thing is absolutely retarded. Singapore is trying to use this as some sort of power play, although it started off as a bloody legal dispute. If that is the sum of their evidence, then there are no grounds for impeachment at all.
My Solution:
Singapore: Apologize to Albert Neurath for Relorian's actions (since they are really the cause of the whole thing), and work to fix that clause in the charter if you don't leave.
Hekter: Drop the impeachment motion. You will not win, and you will lose a lot of credibility.
Albert Neurath: Redo the whole Pakistan vote, and write some impeachment guidelines.
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Comments
Thank you for this. I believe you brought up some important parts that the people from the nations attempting to remove Albert are keeping secret. There is alot of treachery at hand. All should be cautious in this matter. We have no idea what head these people will be calling for next. Some of them already have South Africa on the list.
atliia
South African rep. to Sol.
Pretty much the only alliances that seem together are the ones bent on taking over eRep :/
this needs voted up. Albert is trying to unify the most fail alliance in eRep and is the best hope to give this alliance international credibility and is about to be impeached for a move that has been applauded by many in the international community?
ePakistan allowed eSerbia the opportunity to seize FROM SoL a precious high iron region which th SoL economy despertely needs.
long live Albert Neurath
vote it up!
Mother of god, it's Sander Cohen! You're one crazy SOB! Love the rabbit avatar too, it's fitting. See you later, my little moth!
Albert is a smart and rational guy, and is probably one of the best Chairmen Sol can ever have.
Retarded indeed. bunch of idiots. no wonder Sol never go far.
Albert is a smart and rational guy, and is probably one of the best Chairmen Sol can ever have. [2]
Albert is a smart and rational guy, and is probably one of the best Chairmen Sol can ever have. [2]
Sander Cohen, basically nobody disagrees with the expulsion of Pakistan. The issue is whether the actual vote on it failed because of members' inactivity or not. And well, honestly it did fail. That's why repeating the vote is needed. This current 'debate' is not about what you think. Nobody is campaigning for keeping Pakistan in Sol.
And Albert was very far from rational in this debate, he lost his temper and acted inappropriately.
"Albert Neurath: Has asked for proof of wrongdoing, called Relorian incompetent, and wished he could have had him lose his Rep access that he SHOULD NOT HAVE HAD."
"Relorian should not have had his Rep access remain available, and probably should not have opened his mouth in the first place."
At the time of the debate Relorian was not an advisory representative. He wasn't set as one on the Sol forums either if I remember correctly. Also Albert thought that Relorian is an advisory representative and wanted to kick him out from that position. It had nothing to do with correcting wrongly set access.
The proposal to remove him is outrageous and at the expense of one countries wishes...ironically that same country deemed 4 countries as not enough to expel and inactive country who violated its alliance.
Nagyzee:
Relorian was registered as an Advisory Representative on the Sol forums at the time, and might still be registered as one as well. Under those circumstances, even though the debate was quote honestly not one of the Chairman's shining moments, his actions become much more understandable. If Relorian was not an advisory representative at the time but was still registered as one, then many people would take that to be the truth, and act accordingly.
Jeff, you are wrong on two accounts:
1. Relorian was not registered as an advisory representative at the time of the debate.
2. Albert actually though that Relorian is one of the active advisory representatives of Singapore. If you are trying to imply that Albert simply wanted to correct a mistake (which wasn't even there, period) then you are fabricating a lie, sorry. Also he actually threatened Relorian with removing his forum access altogether.
What if people wouldn't try to whitewash things but instead try to work on a solution?
Okay, I've found the source of the problem. He was not a member of the advisory representative group and thus didn't have access but as he didn't have any other group set as default his ex-title remained under his name.
That doesn't change the second point at all though. Albert thought that he is a legit and active advisory representative.
"basically nobody disagrees with the expulsion of Pakistan."
this is obvious, but i admit i did not word my post correctly. my point is that the vote is simply a formality. there is no point in contesting the issue further, words were exchanged in the heat of an argument let it go. this entire "debate" is another embarrasement to Sol.
@Jeff Hamilton: I suggest you have a discussion with your President regarding this matter.
its over, we sorted it out in an amiable and dignified manner, on both sides, please either change your article to reflect this or delete it, as we do not need this drama to continue any more and we need to move on.
Plus, you can tell you don't have forum access and it is painfully obvious, even if you didn't tell us, please take my advice and next time you wish to cover a story, perhaps request view only access before publishing to verify what you have said.
Thank you.
@Jeff Hamilton: Also, since when is making comments about my personal life understandable? You really should find out the complete facts. And, eSingapore has no issues whatsoever with eSA. We have been happily working together and look forward to building a stronger bond.
Albert is the best leader I have ever seen Sol take on. He has been effective and really tried to help the alliance move forward. Yes, at times he does carry himself badly, as do we all, I think this has been very much a two way street. The insults towards Elizabeth were unacceptable, but It is my understanding that a firm apology has been given.
Albert is a fine gentleman who wishes to reform Sol, this whole issue has been blown greatly out of proportion, insults are a two way street, and this has certainly been a chain reaction of insults, growing larger and more disproportionate as time passes, this is not good for the alliance nor for the people involved in this argument.
It is my belief that this matter should be dropped immediately, for the good of the alliance.
Wow. A few less than PC comments in return to direct insults from someone who was formerly a Sol Rep and people are proposing impeachment?
Call me crazy, but I'd much rather have a Chairman willing to make the necessary changes to pull Sol from its stagnation, regardless of a few personal foibles, than a chairman that roleplays his position with no intentions of changing the status quo...something which this alliance DESPERATELY needs.
Withdraw the impeachment.