Aus Prime Minister Office
There have been a lot of accusations flying around. Firstly I want to address something specific. POTUS Fingerguns has outlined some very eye opening logs and comments from me, of course she left a lot of it out as well. I’m the first to admit on the Indonesian log what I said, I don’t excuse myself for being tired and trying to type quickly, however I’ll try to outline the timeline and the discussions that were occurring at the time for you to see everything in context and what I was trying to do, due to the length of the logs they are linked seperately, otherwise it would be 17 pages long.
This whole situation brought up by the POTUS Fingerguns started on the in the very beginning on the 23rd of January 2013 at approximately 1400 (2pm) AEDST when Australia went into discussions to try to negotiate with Chile’s then President and members of his Cabinet over the issues relating to regions we held because of Argentina RWing some of our Regions and succeeding, here is the log for it, which Allied Citizens on our Forums would have been able to read it was not kept secret from the public, simply broken down into the main parts:
Chilean Negotiation Logs:
We agreed to meet in 2 days to re-evaluate the discussions and work on something more solid. This never happened as the Chilean CP Impeachment occurred.
Then this turns up on our forums the next day:
Discussion between Tim Holtz and fingerguns
Message by Tim Holtz on 24 January 2013, 01:33:54
<Tim_Holtz> i actually had a kind serious question to ask
<Tim_Holtz> well, chile are being fairly #$%^tarded atm, they want us to NE them while they are warring with Argentina. we said no, its not in the treaty, so they said they may move out and let indo do what they want
<Tim_Holtz> i know you are in a bit of an awkward position in this
<Tim_Holtz> im guessing you wont be able to support us
<fingerguns> we're in the middle of our own war
<Tim_Holtz>[/b] so if we had no other choice would you be overly upset if we got a serbian MPP or something like that?
<fingerguns> why would you need a serbian MPP
<Tim_Holtz> indo are apparently voting on whether to invade
<Tim_Holtz> we want to get big MPPs on our side to make indo think twice
<fingerguns> so like a defensive MPP?
<fingerguns> i get it
<fingerguns> do what you gotta do
<Tim_Holtz> alot of nations are holding off due to losing an indo MPP so we are kinda desperate
<fingerguns> we signed one with Poland last month to keep serbia from invading
<fingerguns> i know how it goes
<Tim_Holtz> ok thanks for the confirmation
Taking this as being that we might be able to talk to TWO, I took the opportunity to send Kravenn the following QUESTION ONLY:
Sent ingame at approximately 0730 AEDST
Xavier Griffith to Kravenn |
I have a special request.
Chile is pissed at us because we won't NE them. During renegotiations of the Treaty yesterday they demanded that we NE them immediately, that they would wipe us and we would get WA, SA and NT back. They can't hold their regions now and I suggested that a better option for them would be Auckland, NSW, Vic and Qld, as it would push them closer to there 10/10.
They didn't like that and basically threatened to leave Australia and tell CoT that Info can do as it wishes. To me it appears CoT is collapsing if it can't hold it's members to its own Charter.
Would TWO accept a membership application from Australia?
Kravenn to Xavier Griffith |
I just joined Australian MoFa channel, feel free to contact me when you join it.
About TWO, I will talk about that with HQ tomorrow.
However, Due to the current amount of Australian population, I tend to think that you will be redirected to ACT.
ACT means "Associate countries of TWO" and it is our "junior" alliance. ACT Countries are under TWO protection and they have access to our channels (if 6 people are allowed to TWO countries, it is like 3 for ACT ones). They also have access to meeting, ...
In any case, tomorrow morning (or afternoon), I will talk about Australia to our HQ. I can't give myself a decision now. In any case, I will keep you in touch
On the 24th January at approximately 1500 (3pm) AEDST I’m made aware that eIndonesia had set us to NE again and by the time I arrived home, the NE was actually winning. I decided to talk to the eIndo CP def0 if I could to find out exactly what was going on.
Discussion with eIndonesian CP
As you can see I have bolded the now infamous comment cut and pasted by POTUS Fingerguns, it was a mistake on my part, I type quickly and don’t always check what I have written before I hit the enter key. In nearly all the logs I have spoken in you can see me do it, even in the one below. I’m not going to give any further excuses, and I have asked the Australian Senate to impeach me for what was ACTUALLY written rather than what I meant.
That said since the Treaty breach by Chile came up, and USA being involved in a secret meeting with CoT and Brazil regarding the arbitration of it it without even inviting us, doesn’t it look clear why we were labeled the treaty breakers, when Chilean Citizens did exactly the same things and more regarding the Treaty to break it than we ever did? Play out in your mind had the USA sided with us as NOT being in the wrong in regard to the Treaty and think about what would have happened? Anyway, on we go.
On the 25th January at approximately 1000 (10am) AEDST I get this from POTUS Fingerguns ingame and the discussion that follows:
Received ingame at approximately 1000 AEDST
fingerguns to Xavier Griffith |
I hear you're trying to join TWO?
Xavier Griffith to fingerguns |
I have asked if TWO would accept us as members.
Sorry Madam President but we can't rely on the USA from what I have read from Tim Holtz and a meeting he had with you, not that he is in the Government anyway. With the current situation as it with both regarding Chile and now Indo, we don't have alot of choice, we will be alone with no protection when Chile breaks the treaty or refuses to renew it next month. I must do what I can with those that are prepared to help us. USA can or will not assist us against Indo or Chile because they are now a trial member of CoT, which I believe will ultimately collapse with the way things are going for them at the moment.
Your free to read the negotiations I had with Chile and the Indonesian CP.
Chile:https://docs.google.com/document/d/13NKwAZSt-uWwh1ypoHAy-91WxUYRRnr6uJa2kTrvI60/edit (this no longer works as its been relinked)
Indonesian CP: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B5nm93wPQZ_1VVZXTnpvamdQdTQ/edit (this no longer works as its been relinked)
Whether TWO accepts us or not I don't know, its just a discussion at this point.
fingerguns to Xavier Griffith |
Very well then.
Xavier Griffith to fingerguns |
If you have any other suggestions if be interested to listen. CoT for us I don't believe us an option now, both Chile and Indo will block any move we attempt to join. Indos log you may find especially interesting, I'm not sure how they plan to pull that off with serious repercussions from CoT or TWO.
As you can see, I hid nothing at all from POTUS Fingerguns, both logs were posted and sent to her as you see them in the posts. I got no further response from her. After the discussion with Tim Holtz I thought she may have another idea, but nothing at all was forthcoming whatsoever. The next Australia knows, USA’s POTUS has thrown us to the wolves over the treaty breach claimed by Chile over a whole 11 Aussies fighting on Argentina’s side in an Australian Region RW, yet didn’t bother to look at this evidence of 69 Chileans fighting in the NSW RW that was supposed to come to Australia under the Treaty:
Chile Break The Treaty
Adding to this, when Chile really breached the Treaty by NEing us, I spoke to chukcha, the other CoT SC on IRC, this is what was discussed:
Discussion with chukcha
If I really wanted to destroy the Treaty between Chile and ourselves, why would I have even listened to what chukcha had to say about NZ losing links. It made sense and wasn’t raised at the time. Had the Chilean NE, which WAS A BREACH OF THE TREATY been stopped we could have reorganised things. Unfortunately, it wasn’t stopped, it was voted for by the Chilean Congress but started by the new Chilean MoD.
Its all out now, the people may decide for themselves.
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