[LSD] Entente or Phoenix
Day 851, 15:45
•
Published in Netherlands 
•
by
•
by LSD Party Centre
Entente alliance versus Phoenix alliance
The LSD party wants the United Netherlands to join the Entente alliance as associated member. At the same time United Netherlands can remain a member of Phoenix alliance. In this article we want to give you information regarding the different alliances. Also we would like to explain what it would mean for the United Netherlands if we join the Entente alliance as an associated member. And what influence it should have on our foreign affairs policy and military operations around the eWorld.
First some information about the two alliances we want the United Netherlands to be involved in:
Entente Alliance
The Entente was founded during the 4th World War, while Spain attacked France. A lot of countries defended France, some were close (like Ukraine and Italy) to EDEN, and some other were close or part of Phoenix (France itself was close to PH
The idea of the Entente was born here: a neutral alliance in between Phoenix and EDEN to unite countries who want to keep their freedom against bigger countries.
Declaration of the Entente
Aspiring peace and prosperity for their nations,
The Governments and peoples of the countries signed below,
Declare the bonds of eternal friendship and mutual assistance and create the Entente, a defensive military alliance.
The founding nations, France, Italy and Ukraine agree to adhere to the following principles of the Entente:
The Member Nations of the Entente are free to participate in any military campaign of other countries unless and until such campaign is directly aimed against any Member Nation of the Entente.
Whenever integrity or sovereignty of any Member Nation of the Entente is under threat, all other Member Nations shall abandon any other campaigns and shall fully dedicate their efforts to protect their fellow Member Nation.
Core Members
France since January 4, 2010
Italy since January 4, 2010
Ukraine since January 4, 2010
Paraguay since January 19, 2010
Associated Members
Mexico, since 24 January 2010
Member Status
There are two tiers of commitment:
- Core Member Nations can't be members of other military alliances (Phoenix or EDEN), they may however be members of defensive alliances (like ALA or SOL). They coordinate the decision-making of the Entente in peacetime (when no war against any Member Nation of the Entente is active). The Secretary General must be from a Core Member Nation.
- Associate Member Nations may be members of other military alliances. However, whenever any Entente's Member Nation (regardless of its tier of commitment) is attacked, all Member Nations of the Entente must defend the attacked one.
Phoenix alliance
Phoenix is a military alliance created on the 4th of December 2009. It was originally founded by fifteen countries, all of which were former PEACE GC members. PHOENIX was thrust into WWIV almost immediately after its creation.
Formation
Phoenix is an alliance formed by fifteen former PEACE GC nations that decided to work together to counteract the increased influence of EDEN in the aftermath of PEACE's collapse. Since its founding, the alliance has added two further members, Bulgaria and Argentina, who are also former PEACE GC nations.
Memberships
• Argentina
• Brazil
• Bulgaria
• Estonia
• Germany
• Hungary
• Indonesia
• Iran
• Latvia
• Lithuania
• Portugal
• Russia
• Serbia
• Slovenia
• Turkey
• UK
• United Netherlands
LSD view on alliances
What would it mean for United Netherlands if we join Entente as associated member? The answer is that we would be more protected, but most of all we are able to influence the eEuropean politics. One example: If United Netherlands is a member of Entente, it would be unlikely for ePoland (Member of EDEN alliance) to attack us as eUkraine has close ties with Poland. If Poland would attack us anyways in that hypothetical case, the Ukrainians are forced by the declaration of the Entente alliance to take part in defending us and so are the other members of Entente. As this is unlikely to happen it shows that being in a defensive alliance would work in our and Phoenix advantage. Poland in this case will be isolated inside Europe. And also because we will stay in Phoenix alliance. We will remain fully loyal towards our commitments made inside the Phoenix alliance. We would only not support imperialistic wars made by Phoenix-members for gaining high resource regions.
Unfortunately most of our eCitizens are not that well informed about our government foreign affairs policy. Nor they know about the different alliances. Or do YOU not even know what alliance the United Netherlands is in? LSD wants that normal eCitizens are more informed about these kind of matters. How does LSD wants to inform normal eCitizens in-game?
A good question, and we will come back on this in a few days, in this new article we are going to present a new plan on how we want to inform our eCitizens a lot more.
We hope that these articles we make clear what view the LSD party has on foreign affairs. And we hope you now learned a bit more about those alliances.
The Libertarian Social Democrats wants a new direction in foreign affairs policy of the United Netherlands one of Solidarity and freedom!
Join the LSD party as a member, become active, take part in discussions, change the course of our eCountry!
You can request access to the private forum of LSD on here:
http://www.enetherlands.nl/viewtopic.php?f=39&t=2076
Stay tuned for the next LSD magazine!
Kind regards,
The LSD Party
The LSD party wants the United Netherlands to join the Entente alliance as associated member. At the same time United Netherlands can remain a member of Phoenix alliance. In this article we want to give you information regarding the different alliances. Also we would like to explain what it would mean for the United Netherlands if we join the Entente alliance as an associated member. And what influence it should have on our foreign affairs policy and military operations around the eWorld.
First some information about the two alliances we want the United Netherlands to be involved in:
Entente Alliance
The Entente was founded during the 4th World War, while Spain attacked France. A lot of countries defended France, some were close (like Ukraine and Italy) to EDEN, and some other were close or part of Phoenix (France itself was close to PH
😵. But without an alliance, France failed versus Spain and was practically invaded.
The idea of the Entente was born here: a neutral alliance in between Phoenix and EDEN to unite countries who want to keep their freedom against bigger countries.
Declaration of the Entente
Aspiring peace and prosperity for their nations,
The Governments and peoples of the countries signed below,
Declare the bonds of eternal friendship and mutual assistance and create the Entente, a defensive military alliance.
The founding nations, France, Italy and Ukraine agree to adhere to the following principles of the Entente:
The Member Nations of the Entente are free to participate in any military campaign of other countries unless and until such campaign is directly aimed against any Member Nation of the Entente.
Whenever integrity or sovereignty of any Member Nation of the Entente is under threat, all other Member Nations shall abandon any other campaigns and shall fully dedicate their efforts to protect their fellow Member Nation.
Core Members
France since January 4, 2010
Italy since January 4, 2010
Ukraine since January 4, 2010
Paraguay since January 19, 2010
Associated Members
Mexico, since 24 January 2010
Member Status
There are two tiers of commitment:
- Core Member Nations can't be members of other military alliances (Phoenix or EDEN), they may however be members of defensive alliances (like ALA or SOL). They coordinate the decision-making of the Entente in peacetime (when no war against any Member Nation of the Entente is active). The Secretary General must be from a Core Member Nation.
- Associate Member Nations may be members of other military alliances. However, whenever any Entente's Member Nation (regardless of its tier of commitment) is attacked, all Member Nations of the Entente must defend the attacked one.
Phoenix alliance
Phoenix is a military alliance created on the 4th of December 2009. It was originally founded by fifteen countries, all of which were former PEACE GC members. PHOENIX was thrust into WWIV almost immediately after its creation.
Formation
Phoenix is an alliance formed by fifteen former PEACE GC nations that decided to work together to counteract the increased influence of EDEN in the aftermath of PEACE's collapse. Since its founding, the alliance has added two further members, Bulgaria and Argentina, who are also former PEACE GC nations.
Memberships
• Argentina
• Brazil
• Bulgaria
• Estonia
• Germany
• Hungary
• Indonesia
• Iran
• Latvia
• Lithuania
• Portugal
• Russia
• Serbia
• Slovenia
• Turkey
• UK
• United Netherlands
LSD view on alliances
What would it mean for United Netherlands if we join Entente as associated member? The answer is that we would be more protected, but most of all we are able to influence the eEuropean politics. One example: If United Netherlands is a member of Entente, it would be unlikely for ePoland (Member of EDEN alliance) to attack us as eUkraine has close ties with Poland. If Poland would attack us anyways in that hypothetical case, the Ukrainians are forced by the declaration of the Entente alliance to take part in defending us and so are the other members of Entente. As this is unlikely to happen it shows that being in a defensive alliance would work in our and Phoenix advantage. Poland in this case will be isolated inside Europe. And also because we will stay in Phoenix alliance. We will remain fully loyal towards our commitments made inside the Phoenix alliance. We would only not support imperialistic wars made by Phoenix-members for gaining high resource regions.
Unfortunately most of our eCitizens are not that well informed about our government foreign affairs policy. Nor they know about the different alliances. Or do YOU not even know what alliance the United Netherlands is in? LSD wants that normal eCitizens are more informed about these kind of matters. How does LSD wants to inform normal eCitizens in-game?
A good question, and we will come back on this in a few days, in this new article we are going to present a new plan on how we want to inform our eCitizens a lot more.
We hope that these articles we make clear what view the LSD party has on foreign affairs. And we hope you now learned a bit more about those alliances.
The Libertarian Social Democrats wants a new direction in foreign affairs policy of the United Netherlands one of Solidarity and freedom!
Join the LSD party as a member, become active, take part in discussions, change the course of our eCountry!
You can request access to the private forum of LSD on here:
http://www.enetherlands.nl/viewtopic.php?f=39&t=2076
Stay tuned for the next LSD magazine!
Kind regards,
The LSD Party
Facebook
Twitter
Discord
Comments
Voted!
JOIN EDEN!
I'd say entente!
Id say stay phoenix, entente is as good as dead. Italy is in the hands of PTO forces, and france is planning on leaving entente as far as i heared to become a member of phoenix.
@varazdinecbrixton: We will NEVER EVER giving support to join EDEN.
@Luuklag: France isn't going to leave Entente, the president and government is pro-entente. They do have close contact with PHX, and we support them with that. As {hoenix and Entente are friends with eachother.
I do not believe that such a "defensive alliance" really works. Look at France. Through their attempted neutrality they screwed themselves over. Lets be honest, when we were threatened look at all the major powers who helped us. Most of them even paid for the total costs of the alliances.
We should continue our efforts at building up Phoenix. Make it stronger, improve the organizational structure, and mot important of all make it more accessible to our citizens so that they know what is going on. This is the current failing of Phoenix. With the new forums set up (done by citizens of our own country) we are becoming a major organizer of PHX(as we were with PEACE). This defensive alliance will never work and makes alliance loyalties only more vulnerable.
stay with phx
''Unfortunately most of our eCitizens are not that well informed about our government foreign affairs policy. Nor they know about the different alliances. Or do YOU not even know what alliance the United Netherlands is in? LSD wants that normal eCitizens are more informed about these kind of matters.''
If 'our' citizens don't bother to read some background information about the eWorld then they probably wont give two cents about the game anyway, either that or they are lazy. Neither of them are going to make it in the eWorld so it would only create more work.
Socialist propaganda blabla I say.
~Garmr
Its not socialist propaganda! LOL
But I do agree that maybe there should be somewhere where the eWorld history is written so that people know of what has happened in the game so far. It would go a long way in describing why current events are the way they are, and where the rivalries between nations have come from.
I doubled checked with PHX HQ and if we join Entente as associated member we will be forced to leave our current position within PHX. We will become like Mexico or any other former PEACE country. That also means that we will no longer have to pay 100 gold for the War Games but instead the cost will become around 300 gold a month.
Free alliances such as we got from Serbia and Hungary last month will not happen any more either. So PLEASE CHECK SOMETHING BEFORE YOU SAY SOMETHING!!!!!!
And just as a note France is currently being occupied by Poland and you pointed out that Ukraine and Poland are still close so it just shows that Entente will provide no protection.
Hello? Poland doesn't give a crap about Ukraine, and Ukraine doesn't give a crap about us.
Then again, if we join ENTENTE, Lolandball will pretty much directly try to attack us as we are no PHOENIX members and cannot count on support(not officially.)
We don't have the military strength, neither do we have the monetary power to leave PHOENIX.
"We would only not support imperialistic wars made by Phoenix-members for gaining high resource regions."
No, we would need to TURN AGAINST OUR PNX ALLY and protect the Entente country that is attacked.
Although I strongly disapprove imperialistic wars, for this (not unlikely) reason we clearly should not be in two alliances at the same time.
As far as all our foreign contacts would go (PHX, Entente, maybe even neutral countries (Belgium?)), they'd all tell us to make up our mind and pick a side.
I'd like to see us as part of the Entente,
But realistically, It's not viable (for now).
Maybe after a massive 20,000+ Baby boom eh? 😉
My opinion? what Auggustus said😁
voted!
Phoenix
Entente or Phoenix, what u think about Entente and Phoenix!
"Entente or Phoenix, what u think about Entente and Phoenix! "
It's the one or the other.
As far as I understand this, LSD wants to leave Phoenix. But I can tell you this right away, there is no Phoenix AND Entente. 😉
Donnie Bronco
SG of Phoenix Alliance
It's the curious case of disappearing comments?
Stick with our current alliance with Phoenix.
Frerk why it is one or another?
Being in Entente could force us to attack a Phoenix member.
And didn't they already say that if we join Entente we have to leave Phoenix?
Well Donnie just said so, if we join ENTENTE we are kicked out of PHOENIX. Fact.
Donnie Bronco hates neutrality 😕
Entente isn't a real alliance.. Ukraine is more or less EDEN and France is more or less Phoenix..
it would be silly to join them (thus leaving phoenix)... but well thats just my point of view.
btw who came up with this idea within LSD? it seems their leadership is focused more and more on destroying our reputation...
"it seems their leadership is focused more and more on destroying our reputation... "
Is that new?
@Donnie Bronco: The LSD (second party of eUNL) doesn't want to leave Phoenix. We as a eCountry know very well our commitments we made to Phoenix. We as LSD are not saying to leave Phoenix. We were never stated this in our articles. We are only looking and want to discuss the principles we as party think the United Netherlands should have on foreign affairs. And we welcome everybody in this disussion. Your reply on here is a different one i received some time ago from you. In this reply of my pm you stated that and i quote you "Entente is a defensive alliance, but to be part of both alliances is only with approval possible, at least in Phoenix." I think that this statement of yours is the only correct one. I think there must always be room within an alliance to discuss things, and not to end discussions before they even started.
@Mitch: what does it means that eUkraine signed a peace threaty with Hungary? Will the hungarians condemn us discussing a possible joining of entente as associated member? i don't think so.
@Garmr: It should always be priority for any government to inform and reach it's citizens.
@DanielB1989: LSD is a democratic party, we discuss new plans and ideas within the party, and statements and new plans and ideas which are being published though our LSD magazine, can be seen as a party point of view 😉 Destroying anything isn't our cup of tea, but discussing things, and giving points of views about it, is what our party stands for. Your suggesting that we want to destroy our reputation is a false one, and i am expecting better arguments than this harsh accusation.
To clearify,
- LSD want to join Entente as assocaited member.
- LSD doesnt want to leave PHX.
- LSD want to join Entente to make a clear statement about not supporting the imperialistic wars. Not for protection.
- LSD's have done research about become a associated member of Entente and stay member from PHX. Our article is based on the answer from the SG of PHX who have said us that this could be possible if accepted by PHX. That's different then the 'no' he said under the LSD article.
I qoute the phoenix charter chapter nine:
"7. In case when a member of the Alliance is a member of any other alliance at the time of signing of this Treaty, the General Council must decide on whether to sign a cooperation contract with that alliance.
8. After signing this treaty, any member may enter any other alliance only with permission of the General Council.
"
So the charter sais nothing about becoming a member of another alliance whilst beeing part of phoenix, so it would be entirely upon the General Council if you are allowed to do so or not.
@Mitch: what does it means that eUkraine signed a peace threaty with Hungary? Will the hungarians condemn us discussing a possible joining of entente as associated member? i don't think so.
Really good point Shakerr so you want to join an Alliance with someone that was just at war with one of our best friends and allies? And you still wonder why PHX says joining Entente means leaving PHX???
This isn't even an issue right? Entente has nothing to offer, there isn't even a single argument in favour of joining them. And imperialism? Well, I don't think anyone will ever blame the UNL of that, regardless of what alliance we're in.
"If Poland would attack us anyways in that hypothetical case, the Ukrainians are forced by the declaration of the Entente alliance to take part in defending us and so are the other members of Entente."
Too bad contracts are void now in the game...
As an outsider (but still Dutch RL so can't see this country fall) let me give my opinion.
First of all, as far as I know joining both is kinda out of the option. As it would eventually force the eUNL to choose side in a conflict still to come. Next to that I don't know but I thought Phoenix doesn't allow other memberships (correct me if I'm wrong).
Next to that, what on eEarth can the Entente mean to the eUNL? It's nowhere near strong enough to help in any big conflict and it doesn't seem like a big economical help either (France partially occupied, Italy with PTO, Ukraine's not a big market either).
3d, it would probably make you suspicious in the eyes of other countries. To give a link to RL, just like some people don't like Dutch citizens with double passports, there are countries in the eWorld that don't like countries being in 2 alliances, full or half, doesn't matter.
So I'd say no! Joining doesn't help the country at all.
(personal opinion btw, Phoenix is over it's hype, Entente never heard of so that kind off shows it's not real known, SoL's never been anything big, EDEN's stable but doing nothing at all. Conclusion: No real alliance in the eWorld atm that really does somethig).
Just my opinion 😉
i agree with Augustus, its better to stay in phoenix, man... i hate that the netherlands is weak