Captains versus Monkeys, how eNL briefly had two presidents.
Day 2,045, 19:36
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Published in Netherlands 
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by
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by Dimi is dead
Captains versus Monkeys, how eNL briefly had two presidents.
I’ve seen some articles about what happened these last few days, but none of them seems to be telling the full story. So I decided to give is a shot as well. Creating a summary that both emphasises where the conflict escalated and debunks some common misconceptions. To make sure we cover the proceedings completely we will start from the 5th of June. Here goes nothing.
RikW has his last day in the office, looking back on his term. Which broke the 3.5 months chain of GPN presidents. He has to make place for vSpijck, the GPN candidate and winner of the very exciting June 2013 Country Presidency elections. vSpijck won this two man race with 53,49% of the votes against ElGorro, the DemNL candidate, who received the other 46,51%.
On the 6th of June ElGorro releases an article congratulating his opponent, but also blowing any hopes of collaboration out of the water. He states ‘for trust you need both parties. It's sad it seems impossible. And indeed it's also my flaw. Just like its also a flaw of van Spijck. Sorry, but I cannot trust him.’ A couple of hours later on the forum ElGorro reiterates that these are probably his last weeks of playing eRepublik, but agrees to stay around to transfer a state company for further use. When asked by vSpijck why he didn’t ask for GPN support ElGorro answers ‘I wanted to become CP based on my plans because of other reasons. I believe in Democracy. Democracy have chosen you. Simple as that.’ On the 6th of June a new Chairman of Congress has to be chosen as well. Odan(an I&W senior) applies to extend his term as chairman with another month, Odan fails to get the GPN to support his bid. vSpijck clarifies on the 7th: ‘We've talked about this within GPN, and we've decided to support ElGorro. He's the best CoC we ever had, he's respectfull, he lives up to his word, and most of all he's impartial.’ ElGorro complies and is successfully elected chairman on the 12th of June.
On the 9th of June vSpijck unveils his government team. A mostly GPN with a few individual additions from other parties. Things seem to be sailing smoothly from here as the government sets up further negotiations with ASGARD. Everything seems to be going according to plan, but on the 17th of June disaster struck.
On the 17th the Ministery of Defence releases an article asking for donations to the Dutch resistance-war funds. It is met with grim cynicism from the opposition. But the first spark came from one of the comments, a rather fatalistic comment made by our Country President vSpijck: ‘This will be our last organised RW, so special medals will be handed out. After this campaign eNL has officially died, and we'll try to re-locate our population by getting cs in another country. Ofcourse, those who want to stay are welcome, and the group that plays "forum" can go on with their silly games.’ vSpijck retracts and reformulates his comment about 2 hours later to: ‘As this will be our last organised RW, special medals will be handed out for your efforts!’ But by then, it is too late.
On the forum Broersje(DemNL oldtimer) quotes vSpijck and demands an explanation. Konrad Neuman(Expatriate currently residing in Belgium and personal friend of many veteran eNL citizens) immediately jumpstarts a debate with Zeeuwsmeisje(a prominent member of GPN). When the comment is deleted by vSpijck the debate dies down and broersje openly wonders: ‘I see our CP has deleted this comment. So, was it serious, or does he just not want to have it known that he has given up on the eNL?’ Other citizens share his worries.
vSpijck does not release a statement or comment on that forum-thread. He does however open another thread to request removal of Konrad Neuman’s access to congress discussions. This is how he phrased it: ‘btw, can the CoC remove that jacky naked guy? Even if it was a girl I don't think it's suited here. And for what he's saying; blablabla, just BS.’ For context Konrad’s forum avatar is a bare male torso. The discussion is long and goes nowhere, tensions seem to rise.
On the 20th another crack starts to show, word comes out that Sweden veto’d eNL’s ASGARD membership bid(voting reportedly happened on the 17th). SKYJACKED(Party president of the Bilderberg Group) has the scoop. The comment section is filled with reactions of disbelief, vSpijck joins in. ElGorro remarks that the government is doing a poor job bringing the news to its citizens. To show his unhappiness with the current state of affairs ElGorro releases an article on the 20st. Where he discusses vSpijcks last missteps , goes through vSpijcks campaign promises and likens him to Captain Schettino. The Italian captain that left his sinking cruise-ship before all his passengers had, which led to a tragedy. The first few comments are positive, until some GPN member come along and see their frontman compared to a convict. Their backlash was great, Reinier Claesen remarks: ‘hows a deleted comment a fact? Your just mudtrowing, and poisening our society. I'm very disappointed in you.
vSpijck reacts with an article of his own, he mostly disregards ElGorro’s article. Instead he focusses on his version of Sweden’s rejection and the future of eNL. About the forum he says this: ‘and then mostly new players, quit playing this game before they can claim their role in eNL. On the forum they do not fel welcome, and get torn apart by old players who feel like they are in control. Debating isn’t fun anymore, people take sides, words are put into their mouths and some players still dwell on the past.’ This was an indication of what was about to come.
While discussing the two articles on the forum several questions are raised for the CP. But over the course of several hours he seems unavailable to answer them. One comes from Girlpower(a relatively young VVN member) who states: ‘We should just ask the CP for an explanation. Unless this is part of "There are several secret conversations ongoing about our future, and I hope to be able to tell you more soon." (http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/pre ... 79392/1/20)
If not, I hope the congress knows about this. Else they have the right to question this and ask for a clarification, right?’. ElGorro reacts: ‘I can say Congress is not informed about about relocating everyone to be citizen of another country.’ Seven minutes later vSpijck reacts: ‘Don't be so childish. Just stick to your word for once, and leave the game.’ Heikanu(a forum moderator currently residing in the US) comments 5 minutes later: ‘Please keep ontopic and just answer the questions!’ Eight and a half hours later vSpijck remarks: ‘lol, who are you to tell me what to do? Don't forget your role here; you're an admin and suposed to be impartial.’ After that the discussion derails and the thread is locked, in the end all questions remain unanswered.
The Finale
On the 21th of June at 21:27 vSpijck creates a new threa
I won't let the CoC compare me with someone who has killed hundreds of people! If he wants to appologize, he can send me an ingame pm. Goodbye!’
The first reaction comes half an hour later from Odan(an I&W senior): ‘well i guess we will have to start a motion of no confidence for the government then. ‘
The thread lingers over the weekend with Tim Veltkamp and SKYJACKED respectfully exchanging arguments. Odan starts his motion on Sunday afternoon, for a Motion of No Confidence the voting procedure can start as soon as the discussion-thread has been opened. The motion was accepted with a 5 to 4 majority and two congress members abstaining. So by default in-game mechanics the player that was second in the elections would be next in line for County Presidency, which would be ElGorro. But the in-game president, vSpijck, does not acknowledge the MoNC and remains seated as Country President.
071Leiden was clearly frustrated when he came across the motion and wrote: ‘wow starting a monc because van spijck doesn't visit the forum, and after the monc the only one left in government is van spijck. Yeah that will help us’. ElGorro replie
And until then, we have to respect the wishes of Congress.'
And that is what is happening now, if the motion can be repealed vSpijck will probably be able to finish his term. But I doubt things will ever go back to the way they were.
I’ve seen some articles about what happened these last few days, but none of them seems to be telling the full story. So I decided to give is a shot as well. Creating a summary that both emphasises where the conflict escalated and debunks some common misconceptions. To make sure we cover the proceedings completely we will start from the 5th of June. Here goes nothing.
RikW has his last day in the office, looking back on his term. Which broke the 3.5 months chain of GPN presidents. He has to make place for vSpijck, the GPN candidate and winner of the very exciting June 2013 Country Presidency elections. vSpijck won this two man race with 53,49% of the votes against ElGorro, the DemNL candidate, who received the other 46,51%.
On the 6th of June ElGorro releases an article congratulating his opponent, but also blowing any hopes of collaboration out of the water. He states ‘for trust you need both parties. It's sad it seems impossible. And indeed it's also my flaw. Just like its also a flaw of van Spijck. Sorry, but I cannot trust him.’ A couple of hours later on the forum ElGorro reiterates that these are probably his last weeks of playing eRepublik, but agrees to stay around to transfer a state company for further use. When asked by vSpijck why he didn’t ask for GPN support ElGorro answers ‘I wanted to become CP based on my plans because of other reasons. I believe in Democracy. Democracy have chosen you. Simple as that.’ On the 6th of June a new Chairman of Congress has to be chosen as well. Odan(an I&W senior) applies to extend his term as chairman with another month, Odan fails to get the GPN to support his bid. vSpijck clarifies on the 7th: ‘We've talked about this within GPN, and we've decided to support ElGorro. He's the best CoC we ever had, he's respectfull, he lives up to his word, and most of all he's impartial.’ ElGorro complies and is successfully elected chairman on the 12th of June.
On the 9th of June vSpijck unveils his government team. A mostly GPN with a few individual additions from other parties. Things seem to be sailing smoothly from here as the government sets up further negotiations with ASGARD. Everything seems to be going according to plan, but on the 17th of June disaster struck.
On the 17th the Ministery of Defence releases an article asking for donations to the Dutch resistance-war funds. It is met with grim cynicism from the opposition. But the first spark came from one of the comments, a rather fatalistic comment made by our Country President vSpijck: ‘This will be our last organised RW, so special medals will be handed out. After this campaign eNL has officially died, and we'll try to re-locate our population by getting cs in another country. Ofcourse, those who want to stay are welcome, and the group that plays "forum" can go on with their silly games.’ vSpijck retracts and reformulates his comment about 2 hours later to: ‘As this will be our last organised RW, special medals will be handed out for your efforts!’ But by then, it is too late.
On the forum Broersje(DemNL oldtimer) quotes vSpijck and demands an explanation. Konrad Neuman(Expatriate currently residing in Belgium and personal friend of many veteran eNL citizens) immediately jumpstarts a debate with Zeeuwsmeisje(a prominent member of GPN). When the comment is deleted by vSpijck the debate dies down and broersje openly wonders: ‘I see our CP has deleted this comment. So, was it serious, or does he just not want to have it known that he has given up on the eNL?’ Other citizens share his worries.
vSpijck does not release a statement or comment on that forum-thread. He does however open another thread to request removal of Konrad Neuman’s access to congress discussions. This is how he phrased it: ‘btw, can the CoC remove that jacky naked guy? Even if it was a girl I don't think it's suited here. And for what he's saying; blablabla, just BS.’ For context Konrad’s forum avatar is a bare male torso. The discussion is long and goes nowhere, tensions seem to rise.
On the 20th another crack starts to show, word comes out that Sweden veto’d eNL’s ASGARD membership bid(voting reportedly happened on the 17th). SKYJACKED(Party president of the Bilderberg Group) has the scoop. The comment section is filled with reactions of disbelief, vSpijck joins in. ElGorro remarks that the government is doing a poor job bringing the news to its citizens. To show his unhappiness with the current state of affairs ElGorro releases an article on the 20st. Where he discusses vSpijcks last missteps , goes through vSpijcks campaign promises and likens him to Captain Schettino. The Italian captain that left his sinking cruise-ship before all his passengers had, which led to a tragedy. The first few comments are positive, until some GPN member come along and see their frontman compared to a convict. Their backlash was great, Reinier Claesen remarks: ‘hows a deleted comment a fact? Your just mudtrowing, and poisening our society. I'm very disappointed in you.
🙁‘. vSpijck and ElGorro share some harsh words too, but nothing of value is being said between the two.
vSpijck reacts with an article of his own, he mostly disregards ElGorro’s article. Instead he focusses on his version of Sweden’s rejection and the future of eNL. About the forum he says this: ‘and then mostly new players, quit playing this game before they can claim their role in eNL. On the forum they do not fel welcome, and get torn apart by old players who feel like they are in control. Debating isn’t fun anymore, people take sides, words are put into their mouths and some players still dwell on the past.’ This was an indication of what was about to come.
While discussing the two articles on the forum several questions are raised for the CP. But over the course of several hours he seems unavailable to answer them. One comes from Girlpower(a relatively young VVN member) who states: ‘We should just ask the CP for an explanation. Unless this is part of "There are several secret conversations ongoing about our future, and I hope to be able to tell you more soon." (http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/pre ... 79392/1/20)
If not, I hope the congress knows about this. Else they have the right to question this and ask for a clarification, right?’. ElGorro reacts: ‘I can say Congress is not informed about about relocating everyone to be citizen of another country.’ Seven minutes later vSpijck reacts: ‘Don't be so childish. Just stick to your word for once, and leave the game.’ Heikanu(a forum moderator currently residing in the US) comments 5 minutes later: ‘Please keep ontopic and just answer the questions!’ Eight and a half hours later vSpijck remarks: ‘lol, who are you to tell me what to do? Don't forget your role here; you're an admin and suposed to be impartial.’ After that the discussion derails and the thread is locked, in the end all questions remain unanswered.
The Finale
On the 21th of June at 21:27 vSpijck creates a new threa
😛‘Because of the latest lies and allogations of our CoC I won't be attending to forum anymore. Just read my last article, and understand what I'm saying: http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/pre ... 79392/1/20
I won't let the CoC compare me with someone who has killed hundreds of people! If he wants to appologize, he can send me an ingame pm. Goodbye!’
The first reaction comes half an hour later from Odan(an I&W senior): ‘well i guess we will have to start a motion of no confidence for the government then. ‘
The thread lingers over the weekend with Tim Veltkamp and SKYJACKED respectfully exchanging arguments. Odan starts his motion on Sunday afternoon, for a Motion of No Confidence the voting procedure can start as soon as the discussion-thread has been opened. The motion was accepted with a 5 to 4 majority and two congress members abstaining. So by default in-game mechanics the player that was second in the elections would be next in line for County Presidency, which would be ElGorro. But the in-game president, vSpijck, does not acknowledge the MoNC and remains seated as Country President.
071Leiden was clearly frustrated when he came across the motion and wrote: ‘wow starting a monc because van spijck doesn't visit the forum, and after the monc the only one left in government is van spijck. Yeah that will help us’. ElGorro replie
😛'You're a CM, so you can also start a motion to revoke it. Let's say a Motion of Confidence or something like that. I never expected this to accepted as GPN has a majority of Congress.
And until then, we have to respect the wishes of Congress.'
And that is what is happening now, if the motion can be repealed vSpijck will probably be able to finish his term. But I doubt things will ever go back to the way they were.
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Comments
Good article. Think you missed nothing here.
"all lies" as the ape would say 😉
Dont see any lies Cpt Schettino
stop being such a child eg, you hate it to be compared with the Gestapo, although that comparison isn't that far fetched, but you can't stop calling me a murderer? We call that hypocrite, you might wanna look into a wordbook. 😉
I guess you mean a dictionary? I can recommend that. ;- ) I don't call you a murderer, I call you a Captain who is planning to abandon the ship. You can read that in the comments of my article on that.
now this is not biased, voted.
Finnaly a good article about the situation.
o7
well done, good journalism
Voted, not biased and in correct chronological order. Well done!
a truly neutral voice in these times is really difficult to find. but i think you really are just that.
a good article showing all sides.
Typing this took way longer then I expected, I fell asleep soon after publishing. I might slightly alter the article later today to make it more readable. If you have any additions or remarks I'd be happy to hear you out.
sorry mate, there was a lot more to it then what you wrote here, and you know it, because you can read it all on the forums. 😉
after reading it all, I have to say that this is very onesided. why didn't you try for an inbiased article?
I read it all, and this article tries to summarise what I read. Obviously I can't discuss every forumpost and comment.
I did try to create an unbiased and (more importantly) accurate summary of the proceedings. Could you specify which events I missed or misrepresented?
there's a lot, I have to make you a list. But believe me, this is very biased. 🙁 some things are even lies.
Come with proof or don't comment.
I'm looking forward to your list. I hope you understand that telling a man he is lying is a very serious allegation.
I'm used to it by now, and since you are writing this kind of articles, I hope for your sake you'll get used to it soon as well. 😉
Come with proof or don't comment.
all in due time, you realise that your actions have set our gov back, so there's a lot of work to do.
Well, the gov failed before that. But I allready posted that in one of my previous articles. ;- ) Good luck with your last week.
just stop your accusations, remember you just promissed that.
Also, inb4broersje!
Goed en eerlijk artikel. Daar moeten er meer van komen!
sadly only half truths my friend P
\o/
Thanks for the summary 🙂
Thanks for the summary!
I'm not a regular visitor to the forums as often as I probably should so had no idea all this had gone on.
it's only half the truth mate, he forgot a lot to mention. P
you forgot a lot to mention. this is too onesided for me You forget to write down vS's responses to eg, and also the on forum refusal of eg to become CoC. odan was joking about that, but eventually eg chose money for his eggs.
btw, why do you think there's a delete function? in other words, vS has never said that. As the ape would say; "all lies" , you know him. 😉
Yep, that's pretty much it. Voted!
Hope the grand finale comes soon, so we can get this over with...
I wouldn't call this bad or good, it is just someone who doesnt follow everything going on but only the public places.
I find it that the quotes here are mostly between the vS and El, but the title clearly states its something else, so next time please do some more in depth research into the other people involved otherwise someone can easely change your oppinion as not everything is discussed openly or being put openly.
Now, as El is still an admin on the fora, the things that will be negative against him would probably either deleted or cut short, what had been happening to some people of the goverment.
Then there is the point that you put your own oppinion in it, not visible but it is there, and that is not a neutral and wont tell the whole story, I wouldn't be able to do it myself so I wont start an article.
It is good that there are so many people still reading and looking what is going on, but is there still not a single person who just lets those 2 people be and go on with the game and have fun, what is a game good for, fun, and that should be all. Now and ever we shouldn't be throwing things at eachother but we should work together for a free eNL, what ever way.
I have noticed that a lot of people that react in this article that this article is an 1 side story. that they don't say it in an article of a GPN member. Can be a coincidence, but a small change that around 4 people only see a 1 side story in 1 article and not in another.
No article can ever be neutral. Even in your choice of fragments, there is personal interpretation. What is told here, may be uncolored, but it is obvious after the reactions of GPN members, that the article tends to point a finger in the direction of van Spijck.
In general, if all involved would have been open to a solution, the questions asked to van Spijck would have been answered directly. When made a show outof it and when abusing powers, the focus changes and thus we see this kind of reactions following.
So, well done for giving an unbiased impression of what happened, but it is impossible to really unravel what lies really beneath. We should,t look back, we need to move on. Luckily we can, now that this whole motion was revoked and the true will of Congress is followed again.
I like your approach, you're absolutely right that no article will ever succeed at being completely neutral. But I tried my hardest to simply tell the story and repress my opinion in this matter. Obviously in the end the reader will have to decide for himself if I did well enough.
I'd like to emphasise what you said in your last paragraph. We DO need to move on. The sudden burst in activity was awesome but if feuds linger it might consume our little community.
These pretzels are making me thirsty!!
[removed]
I also like to add my comments here
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/the-forum-game-and-how-it-is-played-2282078/1/20#com
"So by default in-game mechanics the player that was second in the elections would be next in line for County Presidency. Which would be ElGorro, but an in-game president, vSpijck that doesn’t respect the authority of our congress."
If you are gone use the default in-game mechanics as a standard than use it all the way, dont just pick 1 little part say default in-game mechanics, but ignore the rest of how it should have worked by default in-game mechanics:
By default in-game mechanics you need 66% of the votes to favor a impeachment.
By default in-game mechanics all CMs should have received a PM about the ongoing Vote.
Not going to forum as CP is not against the Forum LawBook nor against anything it doesn't hinder the democracy and if 1 uses representatives to stay in touch with congress on relevant issues than there should not have been a issue.
To force people to be on the forum with out there ever having been a law set for it, is ridiculous. And if this was truly that important to some people they could have started a debate on the forum and hear how other congress members and perhaps how normal citizens would have feelt about it, instead a MoNC was started against the Government which does not included the CP as stated by the lawbook, since this vote was done by rules of the lawbook and NOT by rules of in-game mechanics one could argue that vS would not be removed from hes position as CP. If you want to use argument but a In-game impeachment is impossible than you could have started a Impeach vote and use the in-game mechanic rules.
In the end this MoNC was stared cause the CP refused to personally use the forum which to me is no reason to use something meant for emergency's not something which in my eyes isnt that big of a deal, those that find it a big deal, should have stared a debate about it but instead initiated a MoNC.
Thank you for quoting that excerpt, I corrected the grammatical mistake and removed the judgemental(albeit true) line.
Interested in a United & free Netherlands...
Its time for a fresh start..
Nomadicracer for CP..
Please read, share & Vote.. Thanks!
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/2282872/1/20
very nicely condensed article, historic worthy.