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Every month in eRep sort of equals 4 years in RL so we're talking about stuff at least 160+ years old in RL for the Kimi thingy, 210+ years of MdR and 260+ of State Properties...

Need I say more?

I support removing these historic motions. I second the reasoning of Weekstrom above.

1 month equals RL years.. not a fan of that theory. However I do agree these motions are outdated. They've served their centence so to speak.

As for state properties, these include the communes. By removing the motion does this mean that the netherlands loses these communes and gifts them to the current owners?

The debt and blacklist motion can be removed without a problem. We've evolved as a country (or atleast I feel like we did), zand erover en door 🙂.

"By removing the motion does this mean that the netherlands loses these communes and gifts them to the current owners?"

The name of the motion (which the person making the proposal botched) is "State properties in finance sheet". The motion itself (if you have bothered to read it) says nothing about ownership of communes, that is defined in Article 7.1 of Constitution:

1. The Treasury of the Netherlands consists of all currencies, companies, and organizations owned by the Netherlands.

As those companies are still owned by us (via middle-mans of Heikanu and Dave Brinkman), there is 0 reason to gift them away because of random motion, as they remain part of Treasury of the Netherlands.

That's only politically speaking Shawtyl0w. As in a CP/congress period being 1 month compared to 4 years. In all other aspects the comparison is rubbish indeed.

agreed on the state properties motion.

debt of spijck:
him and kordak made a huge mess. congress decided to be merciful and only put about 20% of the financials on each of them. kordak paid and has made amends in the years after.
spijck refused to pay all, and fled the country before we could put him on the blacklist for it.

citizenship stripping enforcing:
not allowed in gov/congress. not eligible for gov programs etc.

Yes, if Van Spijck would have been an eNL citizen at the time, we would have blacklisted him, but as that only can be done with eNL citizens, we created this motion...

Nevertheless, I think it is a very good remark that after a few years these motions lose value, as people themselves change (and hopefully learn from their mistakes), and new people enter our community, who know nothing about what happened those days...


Citizenship stripping clearly is different from the blacklist. Both measures were taken simultaneously, clearly illustrating that they are different. Also, the blacklisting of kimi was revoked recently, so that clearly implies that he can do those things again that blacklisted people cannot. So citizenship stripping might indeed remove eligibility for gov programs, but it definitely does not apply to gov/congress membership.

unless the debt has been repaid and perhaps some sort of apology i don't see a reason to remove that motion.

yes it's different from the blacklist, however since non eNL citizens aren't allowed in gov/congress they are also not eligible for those positions.

Blacklist and citizenship stripping may be looked at as being 2 different things, they both are a relic from the past forum. Removing BL should also mean removing other measures as hardly anyone will understand. That is apart from the ones that designed all those "forum tricks".

As you keep telling BS odan I will restate what I said before in the congress PM on your earlier remarks there;

Quote from odan:
"even if it was by a mistake, he did flee the country after making that reputation damaging debt for our country. it took 1 citizen completely emptying his account for us to even manage it. and don't forget we had the whole PG debacle after him fleeing.

if he had paid his share and then left the country without further incidents thereafter, i'd still not like the guy but see no problem if he wanted to return. but that's not how it happened."

My response to that
"He did leave the country before that indeed. Not because of the miscommunication between MdR and Kordak. The harsh discussions and accusations after that simply were the last drop of a hate campaign against him from several players of which most quit or were not even having CS in NL. So he did not flee because of this incident. He fled for the rotten atmosphere we had back then.

And when talking about damage to our country there are a few other players that did do much larger damage (financially speaking) then and in more recent times that are not punished. Just because they happen to be liked by the people that made MdR look like a bad person.

I've seen the discussions that led to the misunderstanding between MdR and Kordak and as said before it was a simple misunderstanding between a player being naive in believing payment would be no issue and trusted his CP to keep his word and a player apparently being unfamiliar with the size of agreements when it came to mercs. Sad but simply a case of being inexperienced. And due to that, just like is the case currently with several, not aware of the size of battles and impact it might have on the resources to actually make a difference."

And to the above I might add here as well (didn't in the congress PM) that all players that left NL after MdR also fled for the rotten atmosphere that was mainly created by one certain party and player along with his puppets. Its time you let the personal feelings go odan and try to look forward as nowadays almost our whole nation does. And that serves us well...

Funny (or sad) the topic on forum does not exist (anymore)

Always has been a problem with (directly) linking to Forum: https://tinyurl.com/yycvwmof