[UF] Still Not a PTO
Major Lee Hung
Dear Canada,
I intend to write one final article to address the PTO matter. Hopefully to make some understand that there isn't a PTO risk.
I warn that this will be a bit of a long one. Before reading, try to open your mind as much as possible. Read from our perspective, and not just your own. This is the only way you can understand our reasoning, and the only way you'll be in any position to begin any discussions with us.
Sudden Influx
The first thing that seemed to trigger this sudden militancy against us is the application of 20 citizens to eCanada.
I'd like to begin by saying that only some of these citizens are ours. I will leave it to you to work out who sent the ones who aren't ours, but they're not in our list of invited citizens.
Secondly, our migrant members are not just Serbian, and the party is still largely made up of RL Canadians, at least 60 of our members are RL Canadian. Our international friends are from many places. RL British, RL Australian, Serbians account for only half.
Ambitions
We have no political ambitions, we are here only to fight. Many of our founding members believed on arrival that eCanada had a good community, but this proved to be wrong. Long before the immigration problems and back when the UF was still in its infancy, there have been significant hostilities against us. For the last 3-4 months we have been on the constant receiving end of attacks, and seem to be a permanent enemy within.
We are not here to "take over" your country, but you're entitled to believe whatever makes you happy.
So, Why ARE They Here?
This is purely a defence mechanism, and is for the following reason.
For months, there have been many threats that the UF is going to be PTO'd. Many will put this down to a few people, but it's backed by the majority in certain parties. This, again, began long before we did anything wrong. This began when we disagreed with something DMV3, then CP, had said.
So our solution? We intended to bring in enough people to ensure the safety of our party here. Enough people to protect us from those who will stop at nothing to enact revenge. If the threat persists and grows bigger each month, we obviously must grow bigger each month to counter it. For now we consider 100 to be our safe number, which would be close to achieved in the next couple of days. However, I am beginning to consider whether the safe number needs to be higher long-term.
Is what we're doing wrong? Yes. But I hope you'll understand that we had literally no other option. For months we've been trying to initiate dialogue with those opposed to us, and for months they've ignored us or refused our requests for peace. It is only now that they consider OUR side the threat that negotiation is suddenly back on the table. Aren't human minds a fickle thing?
Final Notes
I hope you understand from the above that it is not just us who are in the wrong. This all stemmed from certain poor leaders being given leadership positions, and the community turning against us when we upset said leaders simply by disagreeing with them on pretend policies. This in turn started a flurry of hostility, and the threat of them "PTOing" our party to remove it from eCanada.
Our ultimate aim is to ensure the survival of our party. Put yourselves in our shoes. Just like any of you would do, we'll do anything we can to ensure the survival of the United Front when we're presented with such a large threat. (Despite at that point, not doing anything wrong.)
To those of you who many months ago wished to see the United Front not exist through malicious political means, this self-defence measure was caused by you and your supporters. For months we've warned that any attempts against us would be met with strong resistance, only for you to laugh at said warning. There are only so many chances we can give before deciding we'll end this threat ourselves. Maybe now you see just how extensive our international network really is.
Comments
I think we can both agree that RL affiliation 😕= in-game affiliation.
Also, you're a PTO. I know it, you know it, even Xander knows it.
DMV = PTO
Strange how if he's a PTO that nothing PTO-y happened in EITHER of his terms or in my term.
To be fair your term was like four days.
"We intended to bring in enough people to ensure the safety of our party here"
If you want people to think you aren't a PTOer, never write again such a sentence.
People can think whatever they want. If they still fear us as a PTO after this, it is their problem and not mine. I know what our true goals are and that is all I care about 😃
I am not inside this issue, so I am not talking about it as I knew it or I could judge anyone, but your words are anyway scary: you should bring people into a country as much as the country needs them, and you should grow a party as much as you think that it can be good for the country itself.
Once you say that, to grow a party, you have to call people from abroad and once you clearify you put the party first and not the country, people will think you are a PTOer even if you aren't.
"I know what our true goals are and that is all I care about"
I'm sure if you shared these goals with other people, they wouldn't be as threatened.
UF Party President CptKaydee posted on his feed yesterday:
"Ladies an gentlemen, crisfire has announced he PTO our party. I guess we're gonna let serbs in after all."
---
He further commente😛
""Join me on the 15th in removing their party from eCanada" - crisfire
We're justified.
I plead self defence!"
---
So he's acknowledging he's resorting to a hostile act in letting in Serbs and justifies it as a retaliation to crisfire's threat to try gain control of the UF (but more likely he's just agitating to see what kind of reaction he might get and what it might reveal).
I conclude that anything the UF says is just manipulative nonsense.
They throw up the nonsense pretend revolutionary rhetoric because they can't talk about what they're really about.
Nothing Prince says matters anymore. He just says what he thinks he needs to say to get the effect they want. Screw this community, we're just objects in the game he's playing.
Absolutely a PTO group.
Time to get serious if we want to stop this.
I would almost understand your wanting to protect your party if your party actually stood for something other then..
"Core Plan
1.) Invade eUSA
2.) Defeat eUSA"
from your CP article http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/-ps4cp-manifesto-for-primary-2431730/1/20
Which is almost as reckless as letting in Serb PTOers, your just bad news all round and im surprised you have even 1 actual canadian in your party, shame on them if they sit on their hands while you pollute a community that has had its up and downs over the 5 years ive been in it but seems to come togther when the going gets tough.
While you sit there laughing at responses to your actions and toy with what you probably hold in contempt realize that myself and others will not let you destroy or pollute something we have given RL time to, there is NOTHING more valuable then peoples RL time and it will be defended
While I dislike you I can respect your position and choice on how you play this game, what I absolutely can not understand and hold in the utmost disgrace is CaptKaydee aka Toad, f@ckin traitor.
As mentioned in the comments, the manifesto was just a bit of fun.I have no intention of actually running. derp
We put RL time in to our party and you tried to ruin that, s*** is what s*** does. 🙂
why bother opening your pie hole if everything you say is untrue. or "just a bit of fun". we call them lies where we're from.
Yeah, that's strange to me. I always thought they were jokes 🙁
There is no such thing as a PTO. It is simply "P" - Politics. If UF, or any political party for that matter, can attract citizen avatars for the purpose of building their base and aren't breaking any eRepublik laws in the process, they are playing the game the way it was designed to be played.
The problem is that they aren't playing the game the way some players want it to be played. That's what makes people sore and its why we have meaningless oxymoron acronyms. Of course its a PTO when your candidate loses!
Do you think that eRep doesn't know how to prevent this or at least minimize it? Of course they do. They could strengthen immigration laws to require a 30 day citizenship probation where a citizen may not participate in politics. They could enact rules that prevent an avatar from changing parties or voting in party elections for a period of 7 days before and after a party election. If they wanted to, they could revert congressional elections back to what they were in the past where a single party president didn't control who was selected for congress. The could do a lot of things that would make these immigration boards and meta game nonsense more irrelevant than it already is. So, why don't they?
Because that's not the game they want you to play. Like it or hate it. the game is perfectly limited and flawed. If that's not the game you want to play, find something that is.
Alternatively have them stop banning anyone who decides to play against them.
So you don't have a problem with the rest of us playing the game such that we label the UF a PTO group and organize a campaign to weaken their ability to carry out their PTO, right?
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.
Get your avatars to vote one way and they'll get their avatars to vote another way. all you will accomplish is segregation, mistrust, and bigotry. But, since those are characteristics that are likely to dissuade new players from sticking around, by all means, proceed.
The admins can also make all vote counts hidden until after day change as a way to limit such political efforts. Such efforts are that much more difficult when the votes you need for victory are hidden by way of a secret ballot as is done with RL elections. To make the number of votes visible in an election, before the election is over, is the worst hare-brained scheme any game designer could have come up with.
Exactly Lysander. These people aren't stupid. (don't tell them I said that) The changes are quite simple and seemingly logical if fairness and impartiality were important. Clearly they aren't. So, we are left to imply that eRep wants and actively supports pto's and political chaos.
I would not be surprised if eRep is working on new citizenship rules that will eliminate the need for congressional approval. From a business perspective, an Avatar's nationality is irrelevant. All that matters is that wars happen so that people will buy more gold.
yup, I can totally see that. "your citizenship application to eCuba has been rejected. buy a fake passport for 17 gold?"
The CPF had never, under my leadership, any intention to PTO your party and crisfire trolling you is simple that - merely trolling.
You're using this propaganda and try to fool us. But you can't fool me b*tch, I come from the Eastern Bloc and I know these tactics very well.
From the day I took office as CPF leader, on the 15th of July, I've offered a peace dove and waited to the UF to enter into talks with me or every other party leader. The UF, instead, opted to stay in their corner and continue bringing Serbians to the game. And stop lying, in the past few days all people who got citizenship are RL Serbians. Not any other nationality.
Your party has never been threatened. But trust me, if you continue being this aggressive towards the indigenous community, if you don't stop looking like colonialists, a real threat will come to your party.
"towards the indigenous community" You're Romanian, if Serbs should shunned, so shall you.
Indigenous in this game means a person that has fully integrated in the community. I've been here for two years, I'm perfectly integrated.
You, on the other side, are a RL Canadian but still a complete and utter political failure.
says the PTOer
"I've been here for two years, I'm perfectly integrated."
I've been here for 4 years.
Also you don't get to make up your own definition for indigenous. You didnt make your account therefore you aren't "indigenous" and you get to speak on behalf of us.
its not trolling
Says the troll 🙂
I have a solution!!!!!
If you brought them in for safety from PTO's*
Send all the extras home, all the serbs and all the foreign support.
Once this is done, good members of the community, myself included will aid in any ATO efforts to protect your party's sovereignty. If people feel you are playing fair, they will not target you for a PTO, if they do, other good citizens will come to your aid against these villians who seem to be continuing out of spite.
Pretty straightforward solution, don't you think? 🙂
I just want Roleplay Factor, pls IBB.
lmfao
We are only bringing in high numbers of foreigners to prevent us from PTO'd because everyone thinks we are a PTO because we are bringing in a high number of foreigners to make our party bigger.
What kind of screwed up logic is that?
If you did not bring in high numbers of foreigners to your party no one would think you were a PTO in the first place.
There still would have been a few that would claim they are PTO regardless, but I do agree that if they didn't do crooked things, we wouldn't be looking at them with a crooked eye.
The UF's biggest flaw is their party configuration. An intelligent and charismatic leader (PS) than can almost convince you of his pure intentions (not in this case, I'm afraid) surrounded, unfortunately, by childish and aggressive fools. I haven't interacted with all UF members, of course, but so far this has been my experience.
So Crisfire? 😛
I prefer the term useful idiots. Even CptUsefulIdiot.
I am patiently waiting for the "We represent true Canadians, you are the elite interlopers that do not represent the people." speech.
This isn't America, we aren't rebelling against what we believe is a group of elitist, any player can gain political status in Canada. We are fighting for a socialist state and in doing so, we need to protect ourselves. Two months, DMV announced he's PTO UF if we didn't shut our mouths. So we took action for protection.
I don't care what kind of 'state' you desire. I even tried to work with PS to set up a way to help the youngin's but he decided that he didn't want to go the official route and work within this administration. I've attempted to be open with UF. Even with the lack of anything worthwhile I've let PS remain in the exec board on the forum and in my cabinet thread. He has rarely taken advantage to promote anything from your party.
If you had wanted my help it was available. No doors to this office were ever closed by me. Therefore I can only suppose that you are not interested in working within the system and only seek to further your gain of power by inordinate means.
I came here with my MU only seeking to make Canada better. We have been well received. Although I may not be the most popular CP that has ever been the fact still remains that I am CP and did nothing "to protect" myself to gain the office. I suggest to you that the power you seek is not in the party you so adamantly protect but rather in the individual. Show yourself to be interested in the greater good, trustworthy and good natured. It is amazing what you can do with those few tools.
Peacock wisdom: haterz gona hate
UF is a massive collection of zero value lying douche whistles. Furthermore, they're not even respectable liars who back away from a lie when it's determined that they're lying. They just keep lying.
"Is what we're doing wrong? Yes. But I hope you'll understand that we had literally no other option."
FALSE. You had another option. I was willing to help you and work with you in the beginning, and to give you the benefit of the doubt. You could have maintained that, and worked with eCanada to solve what was essentially a PR problem. But you did not.
And you still have another option. You can always pack your shit and leave, and take your PTO crew with you.
Instead, you're using immigration as a weapon, and holding the country hostage to meet your selfish demands. It doesn't matter where your people come from, or what language they speak.
You've made it clear that you don't care about our community and are uninterested in playing by our rules. We are making it clear that people who think and behave in that way are not welcome as eCanadian citizens.
UF.... you are not welcome here
We got a nice list... you'd be surprised how many you have accepted.
Other than perhaps some fights between the MDP and CPF, there really hasn't been any harmful acts between all the parties in Canada, except the UF. Pretty plain to see that you wanted to rock the boat, and now Canada is saying, don't rock the boat.
bunch of dicks
I'm mostly 2 clicking and I'll be the first to admit that I'm out of touch with the ePolitical climate in eCanada but this line was interesting to me:
"We are not here to "take over" your country, but you're entitled to believe whatever makes you happy."
It's telling that you live here but don't consider eCanada your Country (or else you'd have put "our country"). Makes it seem as if you hold no loyalty here. That says it all for me.
Wait, so am I going to get hit for joining up with the UF?
"Is what we're doing wrong? Yes. But I hope you'll understand that we had literally no other option. For months we've been trying to initiate dialogue with those opposed to us, and for months they've ignored us or refused our requests for peace. It is only now that they consider OUR side the threat that negotiation is suddenly back on the table."
Based on the comments, Xander/MDP and dillpickl have put in some effort to reconcile and attempt to integrate UF's views more into eCanadian politics. Dozzer/CPF has at least given a neutral view.
The PTO hostilities UF have experienced was originally from DMV3 months ago, which IIRC MDP was willing to work with UF to work against. Now more recently crisfire, Walter, and even Xander have been added to the PTO cries.
I hope you realized that MDP was willing to work with you to fight off DMV's PTO threats, and that there was no need to bring in foreign agents to combat a PTO of UF. By calling on foreign aid, you have chosen a route that risks the rest of eCanada that now has a greater desire to work against you instead of working with you.
Sounds more and more like Canada is in the grips of a political struggle between the eUS and an eBrit-eSerb alliance...