[MA] Vento Aureo issue
Day 1,463, 17:00
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Published in Pakistan 
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by
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by bozli
Disclaimer: this might be long and boring to most, I will bold tl;dr parts for the lazy readers.
Hello once again. I am writing this as a five times official and god knows how many times unofficial Party President of Vento Aureo, a Dioist party in Pakistan. I found a need to write this statement in order to close this dispute over the ownership of the party with the party ID 2936.
1) History
As old players know, and many new players doesn't, Pakistan used to be almost 100% populated with Dioists or /v/akistani, a gaming group from /v/ board of our favorite imageboard. Players originally joined Pakistan at the end of November 2007, with the first party named Stardust Crusaders being created by Dio Brando on 11/29/07 (old players correct me here if I'm wrong). Long story short, Pakistan was what it was, number 1 at the time, held entire China and India. I will go more into that when I decide to put more effort into this game. The party was lost for Pakistan when Pakistan got erased and it's currently in Romania, lost forever due to the rule changes. Following party was Diamond is Unbreakable, which is erased. Third successor was Vento Aureo, and that party was active when I got more involved with Dioism. I am not sure about dates and don't have time to search so I will just skip them completely here. Vento Aureo was moved to India when India wiped out Pakistan in 2010, and DDimow restored it under the name Stone Ocean, as 3rd successor of the original SDC. Later on when Pakistan erased India, Vento Aureo was returned home and was found by Dishmcds. At about that time I let Max McFarland 2 take over Stone Ocean as his group Exodus (Dioists from USA) controlled most of the Pakistani military.
2) The issue
That was around Sept 2010. Now fast forward to the Policy's term in September. Policy had an idea of cleaning up our politics by erasing empty parties in order to prevent possibility of PTO. I had a couple of discussions with him regarding that, and I got his agreement that VA will stay. Now we come to the complicated part.
At the start of Policy's term, Pakistan had no congress (correct me if I'm wrong here), and I had Serbian citizenship which I took in order to try something economy-related which I couldn't do in Pakistan. Some random multi was PP. Before that, kualkerr was babysitting VA. After multi got banned, I asked Umer to babysit the party until I get Pakistani citizenship back. Umer was fine with that. So I expected to take back Party in October elections. Unfortunately for me, I was busy at that time so I had no time to push people around, and somehow I lost the elections.
Party name was changed during Policy's term, and I complained to Policy about that. Policy had talked to raao and told me raao said he would change the name back. Three times. That's when I started getting kinda annoyed. After the PP elections, around congress ones etc, I have tried to contact every important member of Vento Aureo (at the time named Lashker), and got massively ignored. After 2nd try, Umer responded, and we exchanged a couple of messages. Ofc nothing happened still.
And here comes the important part. hamis11 publishes the article regarding upcoming congress elections. I candidate as usual (10 terms so far, I learned to follow the procedure no matter what it is) and put VA as the party name. hamis11 says this: Bozli , please give me right information , otherwise , I am unable to add you to the list. I reply him in PM, he demands me to use the "proper" name. I can imagine that was a trolling attempt, but it was my weak spot, so I just reacted nevertheless. I know I could push my spot through "higher authorities", but I just saw no need and reacted, as I consider hamis11 to be my friend. And the other day I find that the multi who won November elections got banned and I became Party President as I had the most XP points. So I changed the name back.
3) The question
All this time I had this question in mind. Of all parties in Pakistan, why did this newformed group had to take Vento Aureo, knowing I will have a problem with it? If I remember correctly, there was total of 7 parties in Pakistan, and VA was 2nd biggest.
4) The solution
I can act loud and go "MINE MINE MINE". Of course, I will be ignored and you will keep playing your game, marginalizing me. That's when I lose and you win. I can force some Dioists to come back to Pakistan, push people around and take back party for good. That's where I win and you lose. Both ways are bad as they will provoke more media wars et cetera. Old players probably remember our last couple of "wars", it wasn't pleasant thing to see and many people quit.
My proposal is following:
- pick a new party
- take it
- write a message to the players to let them know they should move
- give me the message so I can send it to the players
- ???
- profit
Don't be afraid of that move. I have seen my buddies moving hundreds of players which doesn't use IRC at all from one party to another, it's possible and easy.
And of course, if someone is interested in actually staying in VA, you can find the Party charter here. More input on Dioism is going to follow, not sure when.
PRIDE
POWER
PAKISTAN
>MorbidAngel
Hello once again. I am writing this as a five times official and god knows how many times unofficial Party President of Vento Aureo, a Dioist party in Pakistan. I found a need to write this statement in order to close this dispute over the ownership of the party with the party ID 2936.
1) History
As old players know, and many new players doesn't, Pakistan used to be almost 100% populated with Dioists or /v/akistani, a gaming group from /v/ board of our favorite imageboard. Players originally joined Pakistan at the end of November 2007, with the first party named Stardust Crusaders being created by Dio Brando on 11/29/07 (old players correct me here if I'm wrong). Long story short, Pakistan was what it was, number 1 at the time, held entire China and India. I will go more into that when I decide to put more effort into this game. The party was lost for Pakistan when Pakistan got erased and it's currently in Romania, lost forever due to the rule changes. Following party was Diamond is Unbreakable, which is erased. Third successor was Vento Aureo, and that party was active when I got more involved with Dioism. I am not sure about dates and don't have time to search so I will just skip them completely here. Vento Aureo was moved to India when India wiped out Pakistan in 2010, and DDimow restored it under the name Stone Ocean, as 3rd successor of the original SDC. Later on when Pakistan erased India, Vento Aureo was returned home and was found by Dishmcds. At about that time I let Max McFarland 2 take over Stone Ocean as his group Exodus (Dioists from USA) controlled most of the Pakistani military.
2) The issue
That was around Sept 2010. Now fast forward to the Policy's term in September. Policy had an idea of cleaning up our politics by erasing empty parties in order to prevent possibility of PTO. I had a couple of discussions with him regarding that, and I got his agreement that VA will stay. Now we come to the complicated part.
At the start of Policy's term, Pakistan had no congress (correct me if I'm wrong here), and I had Serbian citizenship which I took in order to try something economy-related which I couldn't do in Pakistan. Some random multi was PP. Before that, kualkerr was babysitting VA. After multi got banned, I asked Umer to babysit the party until I get Pakistani citizenship back. Umer was fine with that. So I expected to take back Party in October elections. Unfortunately for me, I was busy at that time so I had no time to push people around, and somehow I lost the elections.
Party name was changed during Policy's term, and I complained to Policy about that. Policy had talked to raao and told me raao said he would change the name back. Three times. That's when I started getting kinda annoyed. After the PP elections, around congress ones etc, I have tried to contact every important member of Vento Aureo (at the time named Lashker), and got massively ignored. After 2nd try, Umer responded, and we exchanged a couple of messages. Ofc nothing happened still.
And here comes the important part. hamis11 publishes the article regarding upcoming congress elections. I candidate as usual (10 terms so far, I learned to follow the procedure no matter what it is) and put VA as the party name. hamis11 says this: Bozli , please give me right information , otherwise , I am unable to add you to the list. I reply him in PM, he demands me to use the "proper" name. I can imagine that was a trolling attempt, but it was my weak spot, so I just reacted nevertheless. I know I could push my spot through "higher authorities", but I just saw no need and reacted, as I consider hamis11 to be my friend. And the other day I find that the multi who won November elections got banned and I became Party President as I had the most XP points. So I changed the name back.
3) The question
All this time I had this question in mind. Of all parties in Pakistan, why did this newformed group had to take Vento Aureo, knowing I will have a problem with it? If I remember correctly, there was total of 7 parties in Pakistan, and VA was 2nd biggest.
4) The solution
I can act loud and go "MINE MINE MINE". Of course, I will be ignored and you will keep playing your game, marginalizing me. That's when I lose and you win. I can force some Dioists to come back to Pakistan, push people around and take back party for good. That's where I win and you lose. Both ways are bad as they will provoke more media wars et cetera. Old players probably remember our last couple of "wars", it wasn't pleasant thing to see and many people quit.
My proposal is following:
- pick a new party
- take it
- write a message to the players to let them know they should move
- give me the message so I can send it to the players
- ???
- profit
Don't be afraid of that move. I have seen my buddies moving hundreds of players which doesn't use IRC at all from one party to another, it's possible and easy.
And of course, if someone is interested in actually staying in VA, you can find the Party charter here. More input on Dioism is going to follow, not sure when.
PRIDE
POWER
PAKISTAN
>MorbidAngel
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Comments
And ofc, for any discussion, please read the article first, no matter how long it is. This party is one of the last straws that keeps me in the game, I don't want ignorant comments if possible :😁
could the name be changed again if someone else won the party elections
when I said "read", I haven't meant scroll down and be ignorant :😁
Voted.
I can imagine that was a trolling attempt,
It wasn't , I was just doing my work . I do not care for someone's emotions when I am doing my duty .
Dioists were a great friends for me , but now , the situation is changed , what you did was annoying .
bozli, i support your right to have a party and name it as you like, however, it must not be supported by multis, or taken from you by multis for that matter. You are part of OUR team and we can keep it that way.
Unfortunately, as you are well aware, parties allow very little control, and belong to no one once created. When you loose support of party members you have to accept it. If you bring in more geniune people into Pakistan and they work for the country, well and good as well.
It is a little harsh to demand control of a party in which you have no support.
Having said that, you suggestion is doable.
By the way, you already have another daoist party namely stone ocean. I suggest that you talk to the rest of daoist and combine the two.
@dodial
You have got a point there. But, let me ask you a question in turn. A group of people, lets say a group of people from Ukraine come to ePakistan. They take over government and gain full control of country change the international policy of ePakistan. Give no chance to RL-Pakistanis. What would you call it?
A PTO. I am sure.
Lets put guys of Lashkar in place of Ukranians, V.A. in place of ePakistan and put its take over and complete turn in policy from Dioist party to pro-RL-Pakistanis party in place of change of ePakistani international policy. What should you call that?
A PTO. I suppose?
@av khan.
Firstly, if a group of geniune players, without the help of a single multi, decide to reside in pakistan and their numbers exceed those of RL pakistanis, then they are in there full right to be in control on this country. This is a game and it belongs to those who play it. ePakistan does not belong to RL Paki's it belongs to people who play this game. The only this we attach our selves to is the map, the name and the flag. So you will find RL pakis much more committed to the cause of the eCountry than anyone else.
Now,.. having accepted the right of majority player already... the parallel that you have drawn is still invalid for several reasons.
1. A country is absolutely unlike a party. The party does not have a treasury, does not collect taxes, does not control policy and you can leave and join any party when ever you like. To change a country you need a congressman to approve your CS.
2. A party is only a logical grouping of people. You can change its name when ever you like you can change its logo when ever you like. Same cannot be said for a country
3. You can make as many parties as you like, A country cannot be created or destroyed.
In conclusion, Now that bozli is the PP, he is in full right to change its name and its logo or what ever he would like to do. But he cannot demand that he be given control of the party for life. It is just not the way this game works.
dodial has a very valid point here.
I totally agree with your first point infact this is the reason why I am supporting bozli in this issue.
Let me make it more simpler.
I am not supporting bozli in the issue that this party is his property nor was he saying that himself. His and mine only point was. This party WAS dioist and it should REMAIN dioist. Or even if bozli was saying that he wants the party for himself I don't support him at all in this matter. Why I am supporting him is because my only point is we should NOT SUPPRESS A MINORITY WITH FORCE OF MAJORITY. Because if you turn a historical dioist party into non-dioist party by joining it in greater number, that IS suppressing minority with majority.
I agree that a minority should never be supressed. Infact there should never be supression of anyone or anything.
You would also agree that in a country of 80 or so voters 6 active parties is representing more than a fair share of diversity.
There are a few things that you need to define and answer.
1. What exactly do you mean by suppression when you use it in your statement?
2. How is being in a party run by a RL Paki suppression for a person who calls himself Daoist?
3. Does being a daoist give someone the devine right to control a party?
4. If so, lets say i made a new political group today. Say 'Dodanism'. I have me and my bro in it. We are a minority. We need a party. Would you give me one as well?
5. And finally. What about Stone Ocean? Does it not already represent this group?
The only control that a party president has is controlling candidacy in only certain circumstances. With less than 10 candidates in each party, even that power is of little or no use. How then do you think that a person can be suppressed by the party he belongs to?
1. By suppression I mean joining the largest dioist party in ePakistan and changing its ideology from dioism to something else through force of sheer number.
2. It does not a suppress a dioist. Its suppressing dioism.
3. No it doesn't and nor am I supporting that, as I said earlier. But it doesn't mean you join a dioist party and then completely erase out its identity.
4. If you have a definite ideology as dioism does. You have every right to form a party.
5. Stone Ocean was smaller of two dioist parties after wiping out V.A. you say go to Stone Ocean. Does it make any sense?
The only problem I have with Lashkar at the moment is that. It doesn't have any ideology. It is damaging the cause of dioism by erasing a platform for dioists (through changing name and logo). I don't care in the least as to who is the president.
i dont get it
A party ideology is not meant to be fixed. If the party members vote to change it, so be it. This is not suppression in any manner. It is in fact expression. The concocted idea of dio is already beat up and over used. It can not demand more inheritance or have freebies over and above what other players get.
Every player in this game has an equal right to influence party running.
--"It does not a suppress a dioist. Its suppressing dioism."
Please explain how.
--"Stone Ocean was smaller of two dioist parties after wiping out V.A. you say go to Stone Ocean. Does it make any sense"
Yes it does indeed. If they really want to maintain a pressure/power group in the country, it is better served by being in a single party rather than two separate ones. Whether VA was bigger or smaller is irrelevant. Party size is always changing.
>A party ideology is not meant to be fixed.
This IS what I am calling suppressing the minority through force of number.
>The concocted idea of dio is already beat up and over used.
Sorry? Are you implying that thousands of followers of dio in erep have no right to project dioism as it is beat up and over used? Bleh.
>Please explain how.
The largest platform for people to know about dioism in ePakistan was removed. I guess, this explanation is enough.
>Yes it does indeed.
I think its not for you or me or anyone else to decide whether they form one party or 2. They can have their own differences.
>Whether VA was bigger or smaller is irrelevant. Party size is always changing.
HAH nice. This isn't even worth commenting.
av khan
I know that dioist were a great history for Pakistan , what they did , it is impossible for us to forget .
But the time has changed , dioist have been 2 clickers or went to eUSA , Dioist here are doing nothing . WHole government is run by RL Pakistanis , only mavie's the non RL Pakistani but not a diodist .
I think that looking at the current situation of dioist , 1 party is ENOUGH for them .
They are not a part of the government
A dioist wrote an article after months and for just fighting reasons 😐
We are not suppressing dioists , look at the number of majority and minority , how much dioists are there in ePakistan? , 5-6-7 ?
WHen you talk about dio , it is still alive but not active , followers of dio are in hundreds no , not in thousand or more .
av , I will advice you to comment with a cool mind , cause of this :
>HAH nice. This isn't even worth commenting.
😁due to this , it makes me feel that you are taking is too much personal .
shut the fuck up up
By Executive Order 3 the party is VA and belongs to Dioists, now shut the fuck up with your ethnic bullshit before I get Shahrose's ass in here, and publish another few articles how Pakland (HEY AOVALHANEGRA) extorted him for gold from ATO multis, then sold it on "for Pakistan", then stole a 100$ dollar account (HEY AOVALHANEGRA) that shahrose bought.
Now, shut the fuck up. Want a Laksher? Grow some balls and join the taliban in rl.
kthxbhai
more on this after elections :😁