Archivo: Macedonia / Archive: Macedonia
rey282000
Archivo: Macedonia
Con el Fail de Aurora en el subcontinente indio, y más recientemente la situación de Macedonia, que culmino con el borrado de los ex-yugoslavos en territorio australiano, está muy de moda hablar sobre los problemas de colaboración entre Aurora y Sirius, o siendo mas específicos, la insuficiente ayuda que Sirius le brinda a Aurora. Al menos eso puedo concluir tras leer la prensa chilena.
Considero que la situación de Macedonia es un tanto particular y se quiere pedir un poco mas de lo que en realidad hay en la mesa. Veamos:
Desde que el camino de Macedonia se separo del de Serbia, o mejor dicho, desde que se fracturo CoTWO los macedonios han tenido una realidad muy complicada: la mayor parte del tiempo han estado bajo ocupación griega. Si, han logrado liberarse en distintas ocasiones pero el resultado no dura en el tiempo.
Ni siquiera el nacimiento de Aurora, que en términos generales ha mejorado la situación de todos sus países integrantes, ha solventado la situación de Macedonia en sus originarias.
Aurora ha ayudado mucho a Macedonia, dudo que alguien niegue esto, pero también es cierto que Aurora no ha hecho todo lo que esta en su poder para liberar a Macedonia. Chile es la fuerza de ataque de Aurora, y en su ya larga aventura europea han sido numerosos los países enemigos contra los cuales a luchado: Eslovenia, Hungría, Serbia, Francia, Rumania y, si, Grecia. No obstante, solo en una ocasión (si mi memoria no falla) los chilenos se enfrentaron a los griegos, y Macedonia no figuraba en los planes: Chile, ayudado por una de las bonificaciones de ataque/defensa, lanza NE a los griegos debido a un NE que estos (y los eslovenos) lanzaron a Italia, y de manera simultánea lanza AS a Rumania para socorrer a los búlgaros. La guerra Chile-Grecia culminaría en las originarias italianas, sin nada relevante que reseñar.
Lo cierto es que todo indica, y con razón, que ni Chile ni Grecia tienen intención de colisionar. Es lógico, por un lado Chile vería altamente perjudicadas sus colonias y por el otro Grecia no tiene realmente nada que ganar (pero su alianza si) al atacar a un país que no lo ha agredido, pero que si tiene motivos para hacerlo. Bulgaria tampoco tiene nada que hacer contra los griegos, sus continuos conflictos con Rumania y su ubicación geográfica convierten en un suicidio cualquier intento de ir tras los griegos.
La diferencia en el 1 Vs 1 entre Grecia y Macedonia es demasiado grande, lo suficientemente grande como para que sea inútil cualquier intento propio de los ex-yugoslavos por liberarse. La única alternativa pasa por abrirle un doble frente a Grecia, pero por la composición de Aurora, ningún de sus países está en capacidad de aguantar una serie de directas contra los griegos.
No hay que olvidar que a pesar de su gran rendimiento histórico -aunque errático últimamente- Aurora no deja de ser la mas débil de las 3 principales alianzas: Aurora no tiene la capacidad militar ni monetaria para liberar y mantener las originarias de Macedonia. El riesgo supera con creces la posible recompensa.
Probablemente este es el momento donde todas las miradas caen en Sirius. Considero que uno de los mayores errores al hablar de Sirius (y de Asteria, si al caso vamos) es que se les quiera tomar como un único ente. Si, es una alianza, pero está conformada por 5 países bien diferenciados y un tanto individualistas.
También hay que tener muy presente, si hablamos de Macedonia por un lado y Sirius por el otro, que precisamente los conflictos entre Macedonia y algunos países de Sirius (Polonia quizás el mas resaltante) es una de las razones por la cual Aurora y Sirius no son una misma alianza. Veamos un breve repaso a los países de Sirius:
Por un lado tenemos a Turquía, cuya historia con Grecia elimina categóricamente cualquier tipo de ayuda de su parte a los macedonios. Croacia: muy buena relación con Chile, no precisamente la misma historia con Macedonia. UK: existe MPP entre británicos y ex-yugoslavos, pero no creo que la historia vaya más allá de allí. Con España no hay MPP, pero si existe algún tipo de acercamiento entre sus poblaciones, al menos a mi parecer. Finalmente, Polonia que comparte un pasado turbio con Macedonia, firmaron MPP, pero el mismo no está activo actualmente, parece que las cosas no fueron muy bien.
A partir de acá podríamos especular con que Sirius ha decidido ignorar a Macedonia (solo UK tiene MPP con ellos), ya sea por el daño terrorista, por la inestabilidad política en Grecia (realmente nadie los considera 100% Asteria), porque sencillamente no hay buena relación con Macedonia o porque Grecia no está haciendo nada contra ellos. Seguramente al menos 1 de esas opciones es cierta y se podría decir lo que ya se ha dicho muchas veces: "Aurora lucha por Sirius, pero Sirius no lucha por Aurora". No creo que sea tan simple el asunto.
El factor que prima es la relación que cada país comparte con otro, por ejemplo: no se puede esperar mucha ayuda de Turquía si X país está en guerra con Rumania, Grecia o Argentina. A veces lo mas importante no es la relación que tú tienes con X país, sino la relación que X país tiene con el país al que atacas. Sin ir más lejos, Chile no se lleva con UK, e incluso los chilenos no dudaron 2 veces antes de abrirle paso a Argentina para que llegara a las Islas Británicas, lo que se convertiría en la enésima invasión doble (o triple) a la que UK se enfrentaría este año. ¿No es curioso que Macedonia comparta MPP solo con UK, el país de Sirius que más ha necesitado de daño? ; Por otro lado, Irlanda históricamente comparte una mala relación con UK. ¿Significa que Aurora ignora a UK? Los británicos y los alemanes comparten muy buena relación. Dicho de otro modo, cada país es distinto, vas a recibir ayuda de un grupo de países, otros quedaran neutrales y otros hasta pegaran en contra, y para mala fortuna de los macedonios, se han combinado una serie de factores que evitan que consigan la ayuda que requieren.
Conclusión:
Actualmente es una causa perdida intentar de liberar las originarias de Macedonia para de mantenerlas en el tiempo. Todas las partes aliadas tendrían que asumir demasiado riesgo. Si se quiere buscar congreso, la historia cambia, por supuesto.
Macedonia es la victima predilecta de circunstancias previas, como no tener la mejor relación con países "aliados" por rencillas pasadas, como actuales, siendo su mayor expresión la figura de los terroristas. Irónico que esa paridad de daño entre Aurora/Sirius y Asteria/LETO sea uno de los factores que dificulten su liberación, aunque es evidente que la situación es mejor que cuando estaban en CoT.
La única solución factible, ya la consiguió Aurora hace un tiempo: Macedonia debe lanzar AS a un lugar más tranquilo. Se puede volver a intentar, aunque parece que hay voces dentro de Macedonia que llaman a luchar únicamente por sus originarias, de ahora en adelante.
El camino será duro. Sea cual sea.
Colaborador: Jhonatan94
Archive: Macedonia
Aurora's fail in India, plus Macedonia's recent situation, that ended up with the ex-Yugoslavians saying goodbye to Australian soil, brought as a result a very popular topic: the collaboration between Aurora and Sirius. A lot of people think Sirius is not giving enough support to Aurora. At least that is what I can conclude after reading some Chilean newspapers.
I consider Macedonia's situation to be quite particular and some people want to ask for something that is not really on the table. Let see:
Since Macedonia's path switched from Serbia's, or rather since CoTWO collapsed, Macedonians has faced a complex reality: most of the time they have been under Greek occupation. Yes, they had liberated themselves a few times, but the result has not lasted.
Not even with Aurora's birth, which has improved the situations of their members, has not resolved Macedonia's problems on their core regions.
Aurora has helped Macedonia a lot, I do not think anyone would say otherwise, but there is also true that Aurora hasn't done everything in their power to liberate them. Chile is Aurora's main front of attack and in their European adventure they have fought against several enemies: Slovenia, Hungary, Serbia, France, Romania, and yes, Greece. However, they just fought in one occasion and Macedonia has nothing to do with it: Chile, helped with one of Plato's bonus in attack/defense, launch a NE against Greece due to a NE that the Greeks (and Slovenians) launched against the Italians, simultaneously Chileans AS Romania to help Bulgarians. Chile - Greece war finished on Italian cores, with no much to add.
All indicate that Chile and Greece have no intention to collide. Is logical, on one hand Chile would have a lot of troubles to keep their colonies and on the other hand Greece doesn't have anything to win (but Asteria does) if they attack Chile, a country that haven't been really aggressive against them, but has all the reasons to. Bulgaria has nothing to do against the Greeks, their continued war with Romania, plus their geographic location turns the idea of attacking Greece in a completely suicide.
The difference 1 Vs 1 between Greece and Macedonia is too big, big enough to pulverize any attempt of the ex-Yugoslavians to free themselves. The only real alternative to recover their cores is to open a double-front -al least- to the Greeks, but Aurora doesn't have any country capable of lasting a series of battles against the Hellenics.
Although Aurora has had a really good historical performance -though erratic lately-, let's not forget they are the weakest alliance of 3 main ones: They don't have the military or monetary capacity to liberate and keep on Macedonian Cores. The risk is just too great that the possible reward.
This is probably the time were everybody start looking at Sirius. I believe one of the main problems when we talk about Sirius (and Asteria) is that we see them as a single entity. Yes, they are a single alliance, but they are also 5 distinct and at least a bit individualist set of countries.
We also should keep present that one of the main reasons Aurora and Sirius are not a single alliance, is the past conflict that Macedonia and some Sirius countries have/had (being Poland one of them) Let's see the Sirius country:
We got Turkey, a country that due to the ex-EDEN link they share with Greece are not going to do anything against the Hellenics. Croatia: good relationship with Chile, not the same story with Macedonia. UK and Macedonia share an MPP, but I believe that's about it. There's no MPP with Spain, but I believe they might be a bit of a connection between their populations, maybe is just me. Last but not least, Poland: they doesn't have a good past regarding Macedonia, they had an MPP but right now is not active, maybe things didn't go as planned.
From now on we could speculate saying that Sirius ignores Macedonia (only UK has MPP with them), it could be because of the terrorist damage, due to the political instability in Greece (no one considerer them as 100% Asteria), maybe is because their relationship with the ex-Yugoslavians is just not good enough or Sirius will remain "neutral" as long as Greece doesn't act against them. Probably at least of those options is true and people could repeat something that has been said many times: "Aurora fight for Sirius but Sirius doesn't fight for Aurora". I don't think the matter is that simple.
The main factor here is the relationship that every country shares with their similars, example: you cannot expect much help from Turkey if X country is in war against Romania, Greece or Argentina. Sometimes the important aspect is not the one you have with X country, but the one X country has with the country you are attacking (or being attack by). Not going any further, Chile doesn't have a good relationship with UK, and because of it they didn't think twice about letting Argentina go all the way up to the British Islands, and due to this the British faced their umpteenth double-front (or triple, I don't remember it that well) invasion this year. Isn't curious Macedonia only shared MPP with UK, the Sirius country that has needed more damage this year? ; Plus Ireland is another Aurora country that doesn't share a good relationship with UK. Does this means that Aurora ignores UK? The Germans and the British have a really good relationship right now. In another words: every country is different, you, as a country, are going to receive help from a group of countries, other are going to stay neutral and a last set is going to fight against you, and sadly for Macedonians a number of factors has combined to avoid they get all the help they required (that is A LOT).
Conclusion:
Currently, it's a lost cause to fight to freed and keep on Macedonian regions. All the aligned parts will have to assume a big risk. If they are looking for Congress, the situation changes, of course.
Macedonia is the chosen victim of previous and current situations. Going all the way back to the past, with quarrels they had with some countries that are now "allies" (Poland being one of them) and going back to the present with the figure of the Terrorists, probably the bigger problem Macedonians have to face. Is it a bit ironic that the so desire balance of power between the alliances is one of the factors that makes for Macedonia harder to get free from the Greeks, although things are clearly better than when they were in CoT.
Aurora found the only real alternative Macedonia had to keep regions for at least a mid-term: AS to a safer zone. They can try again, however it looks like there are some voices in Macedonia asking to fight only for their core regions, from now on.
The path will be tough, whichever they choose.
Collaborator: Jhonatan94
Comments
Pole Chapycera 🙂
-.-
tas eviejo profeta no ganas ni una xD
POLEADO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Interesante articulo.
V/S
PiKaNYYAAA!!!!
Cierro Podio no reclamado!!! XD
Grande Rey!! Como siempre genial 🙂
Muy buen analisis. +v como siempre!
Chile will never attack Greece, they don't want to lose terrorist dmg. Talking about brotherhood...
great truth has been spoken. but it aplies to whole aurora and sirius,not just chile,everyone are damage whores after all.
Bueno, Chile se ha enfrentado 2 veces a Grecia, la primera vez Chile realizo su primer AS a Europa y después de grandes victorias les toco chocar con los Griegos quienes con la ayuda de sus aliados Argentinos retrocedieron a Chile a América, la segunda vez fue hace poco pero la guerra se derritió como helado al sol por el desgaste que les generaba a ambos países, lo cierto es que ambos se respetan, por otro lado MKD es un país belicoso que aunque teniendo un poder menor al Griego, siempre se las arregla para luchar.
v !
//////////////////////////////
vote y opine:
http://www.erepublik.com/es/article/cu-aacute-l-es-el-equipo-mas-grande-de-regi-oacute-n--2436428/1/20
When the world will understand that GR made all countries/politicians/players to believe that they are ,,separated'' cus of politics.
5-6 months past after GR start to act terrorists. They still have problem in politics? Please don't be silly.
Even a small kid can see that they made the biggest strategy in erep not only cus others are stupid and can't made something like that too but because GR players are stupid and still spend a thousand of euros and they can fight everywhere.
Every1 is afraid of them cus countries don't want to lost terrorist dmg? HAHAHA biggest joke i heard today.
If few countries start gang-bang GR there will be no more terrorist all of them will focus and fight to protect their own regions so please in future don't talk jokes that some1 is afraid of them something different is happening behind the scene.
Regards.
Good analyze .
Vote
Buen artículo, de los pocos que valen la pena.
Hay algo cierto, Sirius no ha apoyado a Aurora como Aurora lo ha hecho con Sirius, Macedonia se puede liberar y mantenerse, pero es obvio que no con puro Aurora ya que si bien Chile ha dejado mucho por Macedonia, no es suficiente, otro país fuerte es Bulgaria, pero como mencionas, no tienen nada que hacer contra Grecia, sin contar que tienen a Rumania encima (Asteria 2 - 0 Aurora). Si Aurora y Sirius coordinaran daño, tendrían como hacerle frente a Leto/Asteria que han trabajo bien juntos.
Buena visión del juego!
Son muchas los supuestos y comentarios basados en asunción, sin embargo en ocasiones le atinas.
Sólo investiga un poco mas, con el pasar de los días y las semanas te darás cuenta de lo errático de tus comentarios.
Estamos en tiempos de CO y la economía de macedonia no es buena, inclusive he puesto +20K cc para ayudarlos en CO y sin contar el valor de los tankes.
Esa es la misma razón por la cual china logró repeler 3 amenazas por parte de aurora, conjugado con una estrategia a destiempo.
Hace pocas semanas/meses atras, aurora dominaba el eMundo, hoy se ve desgastada y mermada, como se han visto absolutamente TODAS las alianzas.
Hay nuevas caras, nuevos pensamientos e ideas.
Veamos como culmina septiembre y que sean los resultados que hablen.
Saludos al Presidente de mi club de fan en eVene, y a todos mis fan en eVene ofc 😘**
Esa es la clave, cuando sencillamente quieres mostrar tu descontento, pero realmente no te quieres "mojar" con un resultado: vaguedades. "En ocasiones le atinas" "investiga un poco mas" "lo erratico de tus comentarios" entre mas vago seas con el uso de las palabras, mejor todavia, no puede nacer ningun debate serio de eso. Y sin embargo, cuando dejas de decir vaguedades, se nota que tienes poca idea de lo que dices, porque decir que Aurora dominaba el eMundo, con la paridad de fuerza que hay entre los bloques, pues sencillamente te delatas :3
Siga cuidando las reservas de eVene, Don Merentes 😘**
nice one 😉
Resumiendo UK y Ucrania es para AURORA lo que Macedonia para algunos de Sirius, les importa mas su situacion con los bonnus etc que desgastarse en una guerra directa contra Grecia que es la unica solucion que yo veo por la diferencia de daño que tiene los dos.
En fin a ver si las cosas mejoran para ellos luego buen articulo V.
whos macedonia? you consider those slavs as maceonians? as an ancient tribe? lol
anyway, i thnk they have to choose...
cause if they want to call them an ancient tribe they have to admit that they are stupit... 2.500 years after the slav chan alexander they gave nothing yo the world... nothing... a musician... a writer... a painter... nothing!!!!
so
you want to be ancient and stupit or just another slav?
btw.... i really love that japan flag!
Baba, Sofoklis Shortsanitis(Black Man) is the real greek, Otto (German) also, Constantine the great (Roman) was also greek, Alexander The Great (Macedonian) pure greek, Angela Marcel (German) greek..Ciril and Metdoiy (Macedonians) greeks as well....
When you gonna stop it?
Ciril and Metody are born in Thessaloniki but they gave the Slav alphabet, their students went to Bulgaria where they gave us the Bulgarian alphabet .. no Macedonian here
Reported for insults.
We gave the greatest general to the world, A lots of writers and musicians, we gave latter to the all Slavs, yet you are still gaining our achievements as yours own...Sad.
Ps. Macedonians had never been tribe, WE were, WE are and WE shall be a Macedonian Nation.
Macedonia Timeless !
yes, the greatest general that made a hellenistic world!!!!
he was greek or stupit?
He was Macedonian and you are stupiT.
What was Constantine the great , a Hellenic or greek or????
But he used your letter and language to run his empire and he converted you from pederasts in to Christians...
Another great non greek general/emperor who you are glorifying him and trying to present him as a greek...
I assume that after 50 ears you will be saying that Angela Marcel was Hellenic...LoL
Angela Merkel is the biggest hellen of them all,she singlehandedly saved their sorry bankrupt asses. but it's understandable,after all modern "greeks" are nothin more than a bunch of helenized turks,vlachs,macedonians,jews etc. by the great inventor of the "modern greeks" - king oto of bavaria,the one that gave them their country,flag colours,constitution etc. and speaking of their first constituiton they should really read it,it has many truths that are hard for them to bare.
proletarec he made the world speak think write and worship greek, you can see it form india to outside your houses so or he is greek or stupit... 🙂 your proclapations are for kids and i m still waiting for names...
aron you still hide against others to make us hurt? i m your merkel and that is your problem 🙂 i know mine. yes king otto was german and we know it, tell me now if your chans were greeks 🙂
but do you know your first constitution and who are the greeks according to it? or do you know some of oto's comments and questions. and i'm not hiding behind nobody,what i wrote are well known facts that are hard to bare for you greeks.
HAHAHHAHAHAHA of course u gave the greatest general ever, jenkins khan ... 😛 sorry my FYROMski friend but u r slavs, not macedonians, admit it like your first prime minister did in the 1990s when your ''country'' was created... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_gjBAhak18
Who are the greeks of nowadays? 200 y ago they were Arvanites: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M99ze151HvA
i love your greek name
Fascist... :/ ...just another one in a row
and 30 years ago u were VARDARSKA ... http://epanellinismos.com/images/fbfiles/images/vardarska_stamp.jpg
sorry my FYROMian friend, truth hurts 😛
Vardarska banovina was untill 1941, but it was 70 yrs ago. From 1944 on is (Demokratska then Narodna, then Socialist) Republic of Macedonia, sorry for your loss knowledge base
Furthermore, untill 1941, the territory of todays' Slovenia was Dravska banovina, of Croatia was Posavska + Dalmatinska banovina, of Montenegro was Zetska banovina, of Serbia was Moravska + Drinska banovina and so on... 9 in a row. So nothing hurts me, it was the way of teritorial organizing of the former kingdom of Yugoslavia, and that is it.
so you was a vardar until 70 years and now our alexander kid my dear greek named friend? 🙂 good name.... means gentelman... not on your ancient makedonski of cource 🙂
well... lets see...
OPEN LETTER TO eFYROMians
erepublik.com/en/article/open-letter-to-efyromians--2436865/1/20
i can write it in bulgarian if you want to undesratnd it better 🙂
The stamp you indicate is before 1941, and it is from the time of the kingdom,... loooong loooong ago before your grandfather was born I guess. I will try to search for you and I will advise you the exact date when it was issued xDD
looooooooooooool so u admit that tito invented the term ''macedonia'' in 1945... before that u called your selves vardarska... thank you for stating the truth even if it hurts you... 😛
ΑΧΑΧΑΧΑΧΑ ΤΡΕΛΟ ΓΕΛΙΟ Ο ΤΥΠΟΣ επειδη ηταν πριν 70 χρονια δε μετραει, αλλα πριν 2300 χρονια ο αλεξανδρος λεγοταν μακεδονας, μετα εκανε ενα διαλειμματακι 2230 ετων και οι τυπαδες αποφασισαν να ξαναλεγονται μακεδονες,... δε μου εμεινε αντερο απο το γελιο... ΧΑΧΑΧΑΧΑΧΑΧΑ
Yes, you can write it in also bulgarian, russian, serbian or any other windish (vendic) language - I can understand it. Actually - you is supposed to be concerned of something: Chinese are about 1,3 billion, Hindu - about 1 billion, Latin - about 0,7 billion, Vendic - about 0,5 billion,. greeks - less than 10 million... what is the problem?
So VOIDOKOILIAS - say as you wish, or either think as you wish, I am who I am, my grandfather told me what his grandfather told to him when he was a small kid... better ask your grandfather where he is being born instead, mine was born in Neguš
my dear friend, can u understand that the problem is mathematical and not historical? alexander the great : 330bc, slavs in the area where u are now : 600ad . there is a 1000 year gap. u get that? not rocket science and leave our granfathers in peace.and then some beautiful day in 1945 , dictator tito called the lower region of yugoslavia ''macedonia'', because he could, because greece didnt react after the war that devastated her.because greece was in civil war at the time. and another beautiful day in 1990 you decided to call your newborn country ''macedonia''.but your prime minister cleared that u have nothing to do with ancient macedonians, u were slavs.still cant understand it? 🙂
btw my grandfather was born in Konstantinople in 1922 (in 1930 was named Istanbul).that makes him and me a Turk? pleeeeeease....
still no greek who actually read their first constitution and king oto's doubts. sad.
Aron, f- in grammar i suppose... sorry my FYROMski friend , i didnt understand anything... 🙂
http://prntscr.com/4imryc modern genocide. where are those people now ?
lol mojov, lithoxoou is a known skopian lad, i can write a book myself claiming that the chinese are from mars. will u believe that? btw, where was ''macedonia'' before 1939? http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_kyi1UHyHdDs/TJBbRR7GRxI/AAAAAAAAGiQ/zOscL2e7hjM/s320/GRAMATOSHMO.jpg
I am not about to admit or deny anything, I do not own any person, sorry... If I can accept that you are greek as you are intending to say, and have no problem with, so what is your problem, I do not understand VOIDOKOILIAS ? Btw, what is the base of your oppinion the Vendic (Slavs, as you say) came here in 600AD? Where they were before, can you help me remind?
Read this for example, there is a summary in english, as well: http://korenine.si/zborniki/zbornik11/serafimov_slavic_crete.pdf