Unban NE from Congress
Day 2,304, 14:29
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Published in United Kingdom 
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by
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by Mr Woldy
I have come out of a few months of silence and humbly managing my own affairs to offer some thoughts on recent mistakes made by our House of Commons.
iAdrastos, Speaker of the House of Commons, has found himself in a pickle recently because a couple of the top 5 parties, who like to have petty quarrels, have both made outrageous proposals (albeit one in response to the other) which shouldn't have been taken to a vote.
The speaker act, drafted by myself almost a year ago stipulates that any legislative change is to be processed by the speaker.
For those who don't know, TUP proposed that a blanket ban be placed on NE Congressmen and they be excluded from further Congress doings. Sven Goran Duran Duran reacted by proposing a ban on TUP Congressmen, though this seems to be more a political statement than anything. I have been informed that TUP proposed this as a reaction to Don Dapper supposedly importing foreign voters to bolster his party ranks.
Now, obviously if Don has been doing that, it is both stupid and wrong, and he should know better. Is there really such a petty and bitter rivalry between he and TUP members that he would stoop so low? Hard to say, though it is obvious how that can easily be perceived as a PTO threat.
However, it is wholly inappropriate for members of Congress to place blanket bans on other parties. I cannot express enough how unprincipled and anti-democratic that is, and if it were the members of any single party who mainly voted yes, it could even be considered a usurpation of power within the legislative wing of government. If one member has done something wrong, there should be penalties in place to deal with them, but to impose a ban on a party is simply nonsensical.
NE Congressmen like any other Congressmen have been elected, and they represent people in their party, who, even if you do not agree with them or even if you see them as misguided, have every right to vote and have a voice as we do. It is beyond the mandate of Congress to decide who is in their house, it is beyond the mandate of Congress to remove representatives based on their party, and allowing Congress to choose by a majority vote who should be in or out of Parliament is reminiscent of the House of Lords, something which TUP fought long and hard against a number of years ago.
The only people who can decide who is in or out of Congress, is we the people.
As such the ban should be lifted.
Furthermore, I would argue that it is unlawful. The Speaker act says that:
2a. The speaker will process proposed legislation and legislative changes.
b. Any amendment or proposed bill will have a maximum 48 hour discussion period with members of Congress and the public followed by concurrent vote.
c. Any bill must receive %50+1 of Congress’ vote to become legislation.
A blanket ban on a party is not legislation nor a legislative change, it is a penalty (a mass penalty) and the house as of yet has no procedure for imposing penalties or making judicial decisions. Of course, iAdrastos is not to blame, getting the most out of party quarrels can be challenging and these are fine distinctions to make and interpreting legislation isn't always easy.
It is not my intention to place the blame, I am merely pointing out that a blanket ban is beyond the remit of Congress and strictly speaking, unlawful.
That's just my two cents on the situation, and if people have issues with Don letting in PTO'ers, they should deal with him and not smear an entire party over it. Whether you like it or not, that party does represent a body of eUK players.
We must not set a precedent of banning parties or groups from Congress. If some members are seen as causing a PTO risk, they should be dealt with individually.
Yours,
King Woldy.
OBE, KCVS, MC, HRH.
To apply for the ‘Woldy’s Young Achievers’ Scheme, simply pop your name in this thread on our external forums:
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Comments
"TUP proposed that a blanket ban be placed on NE Congressmen"
No they didn't.
From what I understand, Kravenn proposed it. They need to bring ALL this shit back to the forum where everyone can see it. That way people can sort this kind of thing out before it happens. Get rid of 2-part in game messages and super secret IRC meetings.
New Era do appear to be assisting Serbia to PTO eUK though and that needs to be addressed. If they insist on continuing down this route then perhaps drastic action should be taken.
Agreed on use of forums
Are you saying it was a rogue proposal? If so why didn't the rest of TUP vote it down.
If it was a rogue proposal is TUP going to exclude Kravenn from the party list a congress election time?
Any congressman is free to propose what they like. It doesn't make it a TUP proposal just because a TUP member proposed it though.
It was an individual decision by Kravenn to do so and most congress members as you notice agreed.
Maybe any proposal that directly affects the party must be passed by the party before being brought up in congress to avoid the party's name being smeared?
The proposal wasn't voted down because TUP holds the majority of congress and they all seem to have a ridiculous vendetta at the moment.
I voted to ban both, would make congress actually productive for once.
So if a congressman is free to propose what they like but doesn't involve a party, how is it that New era the party i'm in seem to be assisting Serbia PTOing eUK, Because me and many friends of mine in our party are loyal to eUK, and i'd very much be disgusted with anyone in our party who were assisting in a PTO and if such a thing is happening that doesn't involve New Era that involves the person accepting those citizenship's.
It does if your elected leadership, such as the PP or vPP or spokesman openly support them in media. While the proposal by Kravenn DOES reflect on us, it isn't TUP policy entirely.
Hollenboer, Dapper and Winston have been openly supporting them. I suggest if you don't support the PTO, in these elections you vote someone other than your current Hollen lot as if you go and see the citizenships accepted page, they've let in a hell lot of foreigners.
Fair point, to a degree. You have 6 congressmen though and 4 of them have let a good number of Serbs in? That's far more representative of a party than 1 in 11 congressmen making a proposal (67% vs 9% for those in New Era who cannot do simple maths).
That would hold weight from most people. From the guy who's followed Ajay around (further questioning on that can be left for another day) since time began? Nope, not buying it.
I've been saying bring it back to the forums for months, and the only argument that people gave me for being against it and sticking with the crap method used now was because it was inconvenient. It doesn't help when the Speakers actively do nothing.
If this Speaker had actively done nothing then none of this would have happened.
The best course would be to abolish the Speaker position as it is pointless. Congress does not need hand holding to tell them which button to press
Sexagenarian are you honestly saying if there was no speak then there would not have any enemy alliance and MU members let in by New Era congress members to this country ?
What I'm saying is that the ban and the BAW would not have happened.
I'm still to be convinced that a few Serbs are that dangerous and that even if they were it would be a bad thing. No one has produced any evidence that a PTO would be bad for the average eUK player
No one has produced any evidence that a PTO would be bad for the average eUK player , the word PTO has been built as a SCARE WORD , UK citizens get nothing now from the government , its under a dictatorship right now , we say what goes , they have stopped players moving around to keep this iron grip control , they also don't like freedom of speech and try and bullying people who speak out .
"No one has produced any evidence that a PTO would be bad for the average eUK player" - lol, did you really just say that?
@Rory Tell me how a PTO will change things for the average eUK player? Will they get less supplies from the government? Will the PTO people disband the national military?
I'm willing to listen to a reasoned argument but all I hear is scare stories about the big bad PTO bogey man, tell me how they will make things any worse than they already are.
The treasury was stolen recently and that had zero effect on the average eUK player, how exactly will a PTO be worse?
Describe to me this 'average player' and I might be able to answer your questions a little better.
Sexagenarian, losing the money lost us regions, as we didn't have the money to set CO's. Which in turn lowered everyones production, so yeah, it did actually effect players
The position of the speaker exists for coordinative purposes, it should jot be rid of. While blanket bans should be illicit as it is a smack in the face to representative democracy, in RL it is often a power of the speaker to essentially strip individuala of power. Example, U.S. speaker of the house decides who can sit on what committees. When removed from committees those individuals are left only with their voting powers essentially, I realize this is an oversimplified example.
Typo, I meant to say "not be rid of"
I agree, you shouldn't judge all of TUP because of the action of one member.
Now apply that to the other issue you are speaking about.
Keep reading. It's clearly more than one person in New Era. 4 congressmen out of 6 have let Serbs in. It seems to be a general policy!
Even looking at Dappers comment above "No one has produced any evidence that a PTO would be bad for the average eUK player". That seems to be confirmation that they are actively assisting Serbs to PTO eUK.
So ban the 4.
I believe that's what congress are doing. You're a day behind as usual. It's still representative of the party though. People know what New Era are up to regardless.
Er and what about the other 2?
yea the irc meeting sounded terrible. Forums or reddit, either way lets have open government.
Congress is deciding to remove the ban on party and instead ban the individuals who gave out CS to hostile countries.
The issue here is, with all the CS being accepted, a desperate measure had to be taken in a hurry. I believe things weren't thought out appropriately but it is my belief that if the same leadership is chosen by New Era to lead it this month, then perhaps a blanket ban may be required in future if the party becomes one wholly supporting PTO. Would we let in a party filled with hostile foreigners and a few UK people if their name was "PTO party"? I doubt, but pick another name and suddenly it's no longer a problem? I can't bring myself to agree with that.
Also, what they're doing is equal to treason, if the law could actually work, they would all be in jail rather than writing articles.
Couldn't agree more with you. It is wrong to ban an entire Party from discussions, instead it should be a case by case scenario of the citizen, not the party
Indeed best is a case to case scenario, ban the ones that are/were actively plotting against UK (whatever party they are member of).
Lift the ban asap from the ones from NE where there is no proof of plotting against UK.
New Era’s recent actions,
- NE members defect to Ireland vowing to destroy the UK, then got ‘bored’ and came back. Straight back into politics to a top 5 party… Nothing was done.
- NE congress, being voted into power by Dapper's multi army (hardly democratic), again actively try to harm the UK by letting in as many people as possible from an enemy alliance.
Can’t we just agree as a country they are trying to harm the UK, PTO NE, and spend the next few months making sure they don’t get access to another top 5 party until they get bored and run off to another enemy country.
But that's the corrupt elites, if we exclude and ostracise their members then weft rather distance their support base from other parties
lets just deport drapper to Ireland. Let him die of boredom
Wholeheartedly agree with you. Not only is this grossly unfair to the three NE congressmen who have been decent this term, as a matter of principle having a blanket ban of a political party that is in congress is just plain awful.
As for whether the votes should have gone ahead, perhaps techically shouldn't have, but to tell you the truth I really didn't think there was a risk either would pass, so might as well humour each side by putting it to a vote. As it turns out, once the majority voted for the NE ban, there's nothing I can do
So it's the Speaker's job to put votes up for a laugh? Might I suggest that a Speaker with any integrity wound have resigned by now.
I think you misinterpreted what I meant by 'humour'. It wasn't for a laugh, but if the two sides want to have petty votes to remove each other, then I just didn't see the harm in having them; both seemed like ludicrous ideas
If you wholeheartedly agree, why didn't you vote no to the ban?
I think because there were legitimate reasons given for banning the particular congressmen from Congress, but I didn't agree with the principle and felt bad for the three NE men who are decent. So I abstained.
'it is wholly inappropriate for members of Congress to place blanket bans on other parties. I cannot express enough how unprincipled and anti-democratic that is' x2
Voted o7
Reinstate the Crown Court to decide such matters of intrigue!!!
Wise words Mr Woldy..lol at a Serbian PTO. You guys really need to get out more just because 3 or 4 people move to the UK from a certain country does not ascertain that they have done so to conduct a PTO.
So with myself and others who left eUK to move to Serbia recently does that mean we are PTO'ing Serbia.
People move all over the eWorld and because they 'maybe' had a connection with a particular party through a player it cannot be construed as a PTO.
Nah, PTO is a national security concern every government should take seriously if they wish the ruling elite to remain in power.
shush Mr Bond. Don't reveal our plans!
Agreed with the article. However the ones in NE (or from whatever party) that were/are seen actively plotting against UK best stay banned for some time (until they regret their actions openly).
lol at a Serbian PTO. You guys really need to get out more just because 3 or 4 people move to the UK from a certain country does not ascertain that they have done so to conduct a PTO. x 2
Can we have some proof please that THESE people have PTOer countries before , so far no evidence has been supported or given to this case this is once again a witch hunt set up by TUP, , in 2 years this is the worst decision I have seen congress make , you are banning people from a mail made up not supported in the game also taking the game outside the game on the forums which not everyone uses , this is just a scam and the worst thing is Kravenn is a mod and should know better , TUP have sank low here and killed any type of democracy in the UK
This is a true sad day for the UK an proves my point all along about how people see it fit to control the UK
I have let in 1 Serbian last month , and I'm not in congress this month, , so many lies , what is next wonder ?
Oh I did'nt say apart from the bit about me this is a good article and show at least some people will speak up against wrong decisions !
And democracy would be trying to get the eUK invaded by Ireland because you couldn't win the CP election with your candidate?
You keep saying 3 or 4. Yet in the last few days there has been more like 8.
So i echo your own words !!!
so many lies , what is next i wonder ?
I think there are some points to be considered here.
1. Congress can organise how it wants to.
2. People can message when they want to (I will never message new era with information because every time I do they publish it in the media Ergo they are untrustworthy and deserve to remain in the dark)
3. New Era congressmen are deliberately letting Serbians in because they know it is potentially damaging the UK, and it will annoy the other parties. They are therefore acting as irresponsible trolls.
4. If the other congressmen don't want to discuss the UKs future in the presence of irresponsible trolls who only want to harm the UK, that is their decision.
The only wrong part of this proposal is that it banned all members instead of just those who actively harmed the UK. And I would even dispute that since anyone who willingly associates with such people in a party shares their views. Ergo even without the trolls in messages, the remaining members of new era would probably leak to those who are currently banned.
NE leadership have proved they are traitors time and again.