[JamesKeiller] Living with trolls. A survivor's guide.
Day 2,113, 17:39
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Published in Ireland 
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by
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by Patrick O'leary
This article was written by James Keiller, and because I'm an idiot it's like 10 hours late. My apologies.
Living with trolls. A survivor’s guide.
Trolling has always been a feature of erep life. When I was a very young noob there was a massive uproar following the publication of a pornographic photoshopped image depicting a two term CP, female player. The affair was known as the Rape of Edana Savage and generated a lot of heated discussion at the time.
For most reasonable people there is a clear line between robust exchange and pathological behaviour of the sort which results in people being subjected to humiliation, abuse, threats, stalking and the slow grind of persistent negative comments. For many of us, the banter is the best thing about the game. I myself have been known to throw the odd dig below the belt. (Yddub says I’m viscous.) Sometimes it goes too far and people get hurt and leave the game.
The recent departure of the Second-in-Command of The Irish Army because of pornographic trolling is only the latest in a line of senior players who have left the community. But it’s not just tanks and politicians that we are losing. Every player that leaves because of bullying and intimidation makes this community smaller in every sense of the word.
My question is this: Are we ready to say Trolls GTFO? It can be done only if we work together. And here I take a different tack to Death And Taxes who prior to his exit, advocated confrontation.
To the exclusion of everything else, including a productive role in society, Trolls are motivated by one thing , your attention. That is the key. You will never beat them in an argument. Not because they have a better argument; they rarely do. Not because they’re smarter than you; they’re not. Not because they have more stamina than you; well, they probably do have more stamina than you. Trolls always win when there is an argument because they get the very thing they want –your attention and a little shred of notoriety in this particular corner of the internet.
So here it is, James Keiller’s seven easy steps to a troll free life.
Step 1
Take them off your friends list. When you do that, two things happen. First, their shouts don’t carry so far any more. Second, they don’t have access to as much general background information as they used to. Do it now.
Step 2
Don’t like their comments or vote their articles. Trolls live for attention and notoriety. Deprive them of this and they starve.
Step 3
Never ever reply. No matter what they say. No matter how much of a gap they leave for you to come back with a witty retort. If you feel someone is being victimised it is better in the long run to send them a supportive PM than to feed the troll with a public squabble.
Step 4
Hit the report button. The admins haven’t covered themselves in glory here, but we can live in hope.
Step 5
Don’t engage with them on neutral topics. The troll will often garnish an abusive article with something inoffensive: a funny picture, a pretty girl, some sporting or cultural reference to draw you in. Comment on that will be construed by the troll and others as tacit approval.
Step 6
Take ownership of your community. There is an election coming up. Ask the candidates if they think it is a matter for the State when servants of the State are hounded out of the game.
Step 7
Keep your sense of humour! You shouldn’t let trolls intimidate you. You shouldn’t let them turn you into an overbearing prude either.
So who the hell is James Keiller? I’m one of Ireland’s highest ranked players in terms of Strength and XP. Politically independent. I have served with distinction in every Department, in Governments of every stripe, with the exception of Finance (they have no work for someone who counts on his fingers). I run the Irish Army Commune, employing 60 soldiers, feeding Q7 weapons into the supply system. I took up citizenship in Serbia for the bonus production. This means I have sacrificed the privileges of holding citizenship in the community of which I am a part. I have a record of standing up against bullies. When the Irish Citizen Army was a much more formidable force than it is now, I was the one who stood up to them for the orchestrated harassment of isolated players such as Luminara and Gonzo.
I was around before the current crop of trolls and I will be here after they’re gone.
Yours,
James Keiller
PS Thanks to Patrick for hosting this article.
Living with trolls. A survivor’s guide.
Trolling has always been a feature of erep life. When I was a very young noob there was a massive uproar following the publication of a pornographic photoshopped image depicting a two term CP, female player. The affair was known as the Rape of Edana Savage and generated a lot of heated discussion at the time.
For most reasonable people there is a clear line between robust exchange and pathological behaviour of the sort which results in people being subjected to humiliation, abuse, threats, stalking and the slow grind of persistent negative comments. For many of us, the banter is the best thing about the game. I myself have been known to throw the odd dig below the belt. (Yddub says I’m viscous.) Sometimes it goes too far and people get hurt and leave the game.
The recent departure of the Second-in-Command of The Irish Army because of pornographic trolling is only the latest in a line of senior players who have left the community. But it’s not just tanks and politicians that we are losing. Every player that leaves because of bullying and intimidation makes this community smaller in every sense of the word.
My question is this: Are we ready to say Trolls GTFO? It can be done only if we work together. And here I take a different tack to Death And Taxes who prior to his exit, advocated confrontation.
To the exclusion of everything else, including a productive role in society, Trolls are motivated by one thing , your attention. That is the key. You will never beat them in an argument. Not because they have a better argument; they rarely do. Not because they’re smarter than you; they’re not. Not because they have more stamina than you; well, they probably do have more stamina than you. Trolls always win when there is an argument because they get the very thing they want –your attention and a little shred of notoriety in this particular corner of the internet.
So here it is, James Keiller’s seven easy steps to a troll free life.
Step 1
Take them off your friends list. When you do that, two things happen. First, their shouts don’t carry so far any more. Second, they don’t have access to as much general background information as they used to. Do it now.
Step 2
Don’t like their comments or vote their articles. Trolls live for attention and notoriety. Deprive them of this and they starve.
Step 3
Never ever reply. No matter what they say. No matter how much of a gap they leave for you to come back with a witty retort. If you feel someone is being victimised it is better in the long run to send them a supportive PM than to feed the troll with a public squabble.
Step 4
Hit the report button. The admins haven’t covered themselves in glory here, but we can live in hope.
Step 5
Don’t engage with them on neutral topics. The troll will often garnish an abusive article with something inoffensive: a funny picture, a pretty girl, some sporting or cultural reference to draw you in. Comment on that will be construed by the troll and others as tacit approval.
Step 6
Take ownership of your community. There is an election coming up. Ask the candidates if they think it is a matter for the State when servants of the State are hounded out of the game.
Step 7
Keep your sense of humour! You shouldn’t let trolls intimidate you. You shouldn’t let them turn you into an overbearing prude either.
So who the hell is James Keiller? I’m one of Ireland’s highest ranked players in terms of Strength and XP. Politically independent. I have served with distinction in every Department, in Governments of every stripe, with the exception of Finance (they have no work for someone who counts on his fingers). I run the Irish Army Commune, employing 60 soldiers, feeding Q7 weapons into the supply system. I took up citizenship in Serbia for the bonus production. This means I have sacrificed the privileges of holding citizenship in the community of which I am a part. I have a record of standing up against bullies. When the Irish Citizen Army was a much more formidable force than it is now, I was the one who stood up to them for the orchestrated harassment of isolated players such as Luminara and Gonzo.
I was around before the current crop of trolls and I will be here after they’re gone.
Yours,
James Keiller
PS Thanks to Patrick for hosting this article.
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Comments
Thanks Patrick for hosting.
Thanks James. A true member of the Irish community even if you don't have Irish Citizenship.
I think this article should be sent to all New Citizens.
Viscous indeed, like the Trinity pitch experiment 😉
I shall study your seven steps. It's a worthy cause.
facing a troll, lot of hobbits and dwarves have tried these commandments..but sadly it didn't work 🙁
and they fed the troll...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FMEe7JqBgvg
I'm adding this to the national library.
backstabbing .....
Abusing national library as personal toy is one step in full corrupted CP.
Will be a fun month if you win....
Voted.
Forgot an import one James:
Trolls will attempt to play groups off each other. Don't be fooled into thinking the enemy of your enemy is your friend. Some people revel in being the enemy.
Can someone please explain to me what happened? Perhaps an article or something of the like?
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/why-our-community-is-failing--2312300/1/20
Malbekh who like to abuse people who are against massive theft and treason in this country got butthurt when he was forced to taste his own medicine.
This Malbekh or now known as Death and Taxes only recently had a party with my tesitcles in it's title.
So i say if someone pays 40 golds for a new party dedicated to someone's genitlas...is that sex abuse also?
But the biggest issue is Conway who left irish army, as congressmen proposed a law for donating a ton of money to britain, took british cz, joined british and openly in his article declared loyalty to britain and using his wepps against irish.
Then when he returned this government welcomed him back in ranks of IA.
I find that unnaceptable..and likes of Malbekh and author of this article have a huge problem with that.
With addition Conway has a history of stealing government money.
Check my article "Patriots" for details of treason.
All good advice.
Good one James.
Great article. I'm happy to see it appears the good guys are winning for now, a certain troll has received only a few votes on his last 6 articles.
Maybe the lack of attention will trigger him to have an existential crisis and to reevaluate his whole approach to the game...and even life itself.
Or maybe he'll just leave to find another bridge to live under.
"I was around before the current crop of trolls and I will be here after they’re gone."
have heard some people saying that - they are dead now.
ignoring trolls is a good way. problem is some trolls have very much stamina and there will always be some small newbie after a while who will feed them. greybacks can survive 3weeks on one good big meal. . and wizardgraybacks can survive on memories alone for much longer!
Very nice article about a real problem in eRep. Thanks for sharing it.
Don't feed the trolls!
how is it going maryamq? i meant going damn keyboard
hahahaha Jokes on you
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/israel-stevens-hot-then-cold-2313925/1/20
And where was Keller when over a year Kurgan was the only one defending people from bullying by his/ your kunts friends?
Forget what happened to Mike and Loyen?
And now when bullies are forced to taste tgeir own medicine....they whine?
Malbekh you speak so highly had a party dedicated to my genitaks.
No to mention he came here as payed sl...to defend thiefs and traitors.
You cant win coz you are moral filth but please ignore me.
When i talk about you kunts i talk to few honourable irish here...not you
lets ignore them for a while i mean after all that is what keiler said and what is this article its a troll article. and what do players like james keiler do troll. the problem is they think being something in a game means something in life. its a pathetic justification for their loser lives.
Nah....they love me loud...
votado
Very good article!
Great article, thanks for shouting!
Voted so damn hard I may have broken my iPad keyboard!
Pffft, gonzo was a pig. Literally the least likeable person in eIreland, ever.
I can think of a few more. 🙂 Anyway, I wasn't defending Gonzo at the time for his charming personal qualities. I took issue with the fact that people were resorting to abuse rather than engage with his argument (it was the whole North Dakota rental fiasco). You survived similar tactics yourself when you came back from Russia. I admire the fact you didn't walk off the pitch.
He gave as good as he got. Guess he just wasn't as up for the fight as perhaps I am.
Aye Gonzo was just a noob that loved to talk shite
James, thanks for that but with respect I don't agree. Yddub was our best tank and quit, we've lost critical players either out of the country or quit altogether. I'm gone as a tank and contributor to the country. There will always be somebody else, there will always be another target.
These are not trolls. Not in the gaming sense. They are bullies and perverts simple put. They can only be dealt with by the community. The only way to deal with them is to spotlight the real problem here. That is the admins, who not only tolerate it but appear to approve it.
This is a browser based game, no browser, no game. I would take the battle to Google or Firefox and report the game for tolerating bullying and misogyny while utilising their browsers as a platform. I would compile a list of 40-50 citizens who are full time players to submit a ticket specifically about the behaviour of these individuals asking them to resolve it once and for all. If they don't, then all 50 hit the report button every time they see any comments by these players.
This is a very small game. It does not have many players. The problem is that the community is tolerant and too damn lazy to make an effort to deal with a very serious problem. Ignoring it will not make them go away.
Make a stand for God's sake
I don't advocate ignoring the problem. I am calling for a community response to community problem which includes, but isn't limited to, ostracising the trolls and placing peer pressure on citizens who give tacit support to trolls by engaging with them. If influence can be brought to bear on the Admins via the Search Engines to enforce a duty of care, I would be all for that. Perhaps you might stay around long enough to try it. One thing that will certainly not work is going toe to toe with someone who is in character.
its a game malbekh relax brother. most of what me and kurgan do is play acting anyway. we play a role.
from another game:In World forums, "Politics & Propaganda" is allowed when a thread contains the P&P prefix. The idea of P&P is to adopt your character's persona and spread 'information', ideas and rumors to promote yourself and defame your enemies. Any flames or insults outside of character are strictly forbidden.
Allowed Example: Town A is full of noobs who can't shoot straight.
Disallowed Example: Player B lives in his mother's basement and has a court ordered psychiatrist.
only in recent times have i been role playing but its fun. rule number 1 just have fun and develop a thicker skin. i enjoy a good comeback just as much as i enjoy sometimes trolling a person although i hardly ever troll tbh.
you though went overboard with the whole cpt jackson thing. i told you drop the article as its verybad to accuse people of such acts but NO. anyway there is troll everywhere . if you play online games there will be trolls. so your choice is play online games or dont and keiler is right if you dont place any comments or respond to comment nobody can troll you?
Really? Do you want me to release the PM you started with me where you say and I quote 'the Irish are the scum of the earth' Everyone has seen the kind of comments you've put up in your media wall, your articles, the IA feed and in PM's. I get the impression you're obsession has gone too far. Now that the community is focussing on you, it's amazing how your grammar and vocabulary suddenly improves.
i never said that death and taxes??i am eIrish and one of its greatest patriots
Sure, when I want to tackle bullies it doesn't get much recognition. I tried getting you all to solve this problem over a year ago, but now you finally realize this is a problem in our community?
It's because your bullies were their friends mike. It's called eIrish politics.
i lol'd
why not blame windows, hardwareproviders and the god of the internets...
you have to learn the 101 of bullying
treating someone like he is air (=ignoring him as human being) is the worst thing you can do to him - it's the same for people in RL and for trolls. ignoring someone completely is like he is dead while still alive
if you fight them then you only give them more points to attack + a reason and you make their actions matter ("i have just done that and they started to make a whole campaign LOL")
Yes make a stand!
Bullies unite against being bullied...
Excellently stated.
Good advice. However I differentiate between the "pathological behaviour" and standard trolling for this sort of game/forum. For me it is great sport to give the standard troll what they don't want, some of their own brand of BS. Mostly this is the troll that has an overinflated ego and could stand being lowered a couple of notches. Keep in mind this is an intellectual type of trolling where the originator can be outmatched by words and a bit of intelligence.
On rare occasions I have stepped up to 'straighten out' the "pathological" type who have threatened friends (like Bia Pandora above). I do not appreciate someone attacking those that I consider vulnerable. If pushed I can pull out all the stops and have done so in the past.
Generally though your observations are spot on. This is good advice for 99% of the people in our game. For the other 1%, who are good people, I advocate common sense. If you can make a bit of fun by poking someone who will respond to entertain us then by all means do so. Just be sure you can outmatch the idiot and know when to quit. Remember this simple rule:
"It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt."
Or expressed a different way.
"A man who carries a cat by the tail learns something he can learn in no other way."
~ Mark Twain
a man that carries a cat by his tail is cruel to cats: krakken atlhough most animals can be carried by their neck skin.
Obviously this is a word picture demonstrating that if one were foolish enough to pick a cat up by the tail it would be learned that the cat would turn on the holder and scratch the living shit out of him/her. Sorry the quote completely missed the logical side of your brain and went straight to the animal rights advocate.
For the record, most MAMMALS can be carried by their neck skin while immature. In adults this generally causes pain.
Note: I am the "threatened friend", not the "pathological type". LOL
I was wondering..
Some days I wonder. lol
But the difference is, all this drama was caused coz bullies got bullied and they can't stand to be on another side.
And most of their complaints has nothing about bullying but some of us keep reminding of thefts and treasons made by certain creatures.
Honestly Kurgan I agree to only some extent. There are bullies in this game that do in fact deserve to be bullied. Trolls, liars, thieves, ect. In my opinion they are the scum of Ireland and have been at least as long as I've played. Their friends are no better than they are. I'm no better than they are for supporting your bullying against them either. Nobody's hands are clean. I've seen many players leave because of them, but nobody seemed to give a damn.
But you don't just bully those players, you also attack those who you have personal problems with. Not just those who do damage to our community or rob our treasury, but those who you've had problems with since the Libertad experience. Those types of problems, for your sake and their's, should have been handled privately or at least respectfully.
I'm not sure who got aggressive first, you or the Libertad team, but if they insulted or provoked first, you have to play snitch and post it publicly for support. That's how people prefer others to play this game, rather than fire with fire. I don't know who started it. I don't care at this point because everyone's guilty to some degree. These are problems you have with them personally and they've done nothing to damage myself or the community as a whole so I think a lot of your attacks are taking it too far.
There are a handful of players you could drive out of the game and I would care less. I think we'd honestly be better without them. If they left, I'd try that much harder to bring in players to replace them. But players you have only personal vandettas shouldn't be attacked as such. Ireland's trolls, liars, thieves, ect often use horrible offensive words to attack. PP and OJ do it often when they're active. They deserve whatever you can throw at them, but anyone who's not vulgar and disrespectful should be debated respectfully, regardless of personal problems.