46
Where I Stand on Training Wars
There have been a lot of accusations thrown around about "neutrals" and against those who voted "no" to the US training wars. It's time for another side of the story to be told. I can only speak for myself and what I stand for.
To make things clear:
-I am not for neutrality. I am for Irish Independence. I am open to joining an alliance when the right opportunity and time presents itself. I don't believe that time has yet arrived nor the appropriate alliance.
-I fully support training wars. As a former Minister of New Citizens, it was something that noobs were educated and encouraged to engage in. I am exceptionally proud of the Baby Brutes. As a TD I voted enthusiastically for the Mushroom and Sol War Games.
-I am in support of a comprehensive ranking up strategy that will help our troops grow in strength. Training wars are a big part of this comprehensive strategy. There are also initiatives being worked on that would provides weps for troops and some additional items involving moving tickets and gifting. These things don't happen overnight. It takes a lot of hard work and planning to make these things happen. And happen they will with the help of citizens like Conor, Kit, Dub and Digits among others.
-I am a firm believer in the process of government. There are two branches for a reason. To ensure that all issues are taken into account prior to a vote. If I am not satisfied that these issues have been addressed adequately and have taken into account my constituents views, I won't vote in favor of it.
That being said, this is why I voted "no" to the first vote for US War Games.
-PEACE had taken out both of our war games in short succession. I wanted to be sure that if we hosted these games that we would not be targeted. The way we are right now, we would have gone the way of Slovakia.
-I did not know how much power PEACE had over the UK. All I needed was assurance from the UK. It needed to be done publicly and not hidden behind closed doors. The more people see a statement like the one President Woldy gave today, the better the accountability. These assurances were not given until AFTER the vote was taken.
-The process was being rushed from the get go. Had this run it's normal course, the outcome might have been different. We are now taking time to make sure all issues are addressed satisfactorily before moving to vote.
One concern that has come to my attention about hosting TW, is that some businesses would suffer as a result. This was the most difficult thing to take into consideration. Which need is greater? Ranking up our military or making sure our companies can continue to thrive? Not an easy choice. Maybe there is a way to satisfy both needs. We won't know until it is discussed.
I hope that clarifies my position.
For those of you who have chosen petty insults to honest debate, I know who you are. You have not escaped my notice.
For those of you have disagreed with me honorably, you have my respect.
Always remember that an issue is rarely as simple as it appears. People have agendas that don't neccessarily take the entire population into consideration. It is my job as a TD to sort through the needs of my people, find the facts, and to make the best choice I can.
“To live is to choose. But to choose well, you must know who you are and what you stand for, where you want to go and why you want to get there.” Kofi Annan
For Ireland! For Independence!
Edana Savage
Minister of Education
Congresswoman for Cork & Kerry, 2nd Term
Former Minister of New Citizens, Two Terms
To make things clear:
-I am not for neutrality. I am for Irish Independence. I am open to joining an alliance when the right opportunity and time presents itself. I don't believe that time has yet arrived nor the appropriate alliance.
-I fully support training wars. As a former Minister of New Citizens, it was something that noobs were educated and encouraged to engage in. I am exceptionally proud of the Baby Brutes. As a TD I voted enthusiastically for the Mushroom and Sol War Games.
-I am in support of a comprehensive ranking up strategy that will help our troops grow in strength. Training wars are a big part of this comprehensive strategy. There are also initiatives being worked on that would provides weps for troops and some additional items involving moving tickets and gifting. These things don't happen overnight. It takes a lot of hard work and planning to make these things happen. And happen they will with the help of citizens like Conor, Kit, Dub and Digits among others.
-I am a firm believer in the process of government. There are two branches for a reason. To ensure that all issues are taken into account prior to a vote. If I am not satisfied that these issues have been addressed adequately and have taken into account my constituents views, I won't vote in favor of it.
That being said, this is why I voted "no" to the first vote for US War Games.
-PEACE had taken out both of our war games in short succession. I wanted to be sure that if we hosted these games that we would not be targeted. The way we are right now, we would have gone the way of Slovakia.
-I did not know how much power PEACE had over the UK. All I needed was assurance from the UK. It needed to be done publicly and not hidden behind closed doors. The more people see a statement like the one President Woldy gave today, the better the accountability. These assurances were not given until AFTER the vote was taken.
-The process was being rushed from the get go. Had this run it's normal course, the outcome might have been different. We are now taking time to make sure all issues are addressed satisfactorily before moving to vote.
One concern that has come to my attention about hosting TW, is that some businesses would suffer as a result. This was the most difficult thing to take into consideration. Which need is greater? Ranking up our military or making sure our companies can continue to thrive? Not an easy choice. Maybe there is a way to satisfy both needs. We won't know until it is discussed.
I hope that clarifies my position.
For those of you who have chosen petty insults to honest debate, I know who you are. You have not escaped my notice.
For those of you have disagreed with me honorably, you have my respect.
Always remember that an issue is rarely as simple as it appears. People have agendas that don't neccessarily take the entire population into consideration. It is my job as a TD to sort through the needs of my people, find the facts, and to make the best choice I can.
“To live is to choose. But to choose well, you must know who you are and what you stand for, where you want to go and why you want to get there.” Kofi Annan
For Ireland! For Independence!
Edana Savage
Minister of Education
Congresswoman for Cork & Kerry, 2nd Term
Former Minister of New Citizens, Two Terms
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Great article Edana, it's great to see TDs explain themselves to the people
Thanks for the explanation
Well Edana i agree on most of the points thanks anyway.
I wasnt privy to this debate but can you give a quick reason for the belief that a hosted wargame would hurt business?
coz we would have an trade embargo with all the participating countries....... donation can be done to minimize the impact of that tho.
Yes, that was the issue. But as I said, there could be a solution that hasn't come up yet. How would the donation thing work?
♥ The Princess agrees that much of the population would have felt differently about the proposal had the UK Prime Minister published his lovely article before the vote. The Princess knows she felt better about patton's proposal having read it, especially amongst the skeptical (and frankly rude) comments made in regards to the plan.
♥ The Princess is not sure whose shoulders to put this blame upon. Perhaps it was just bad timing on the account of many parties.
♥ The Princess enjoyed your article.
Well said!
Bravo. Great article Edana.
Sure, hosting these TWs would have an impact on the overseas trade due to the embargoes, but at the same time it could only help to improve business here in the form of gun sales, MT sales, and gift sales to those already residing in Ireland as well as to the possible influx of those moving here to fight.
Did I say great article?
The donation thing he mentioned I think has to do specifically with the businesses. It is possible to donate raw resources to any company no matter where and no matter the embargoes.
Thank you for stepping forward. I too believe in due process, and I have the utmost respect for what you do for eIreland Edana, you're a hard worker:)
I do not however agree with some statements here. patton cannot be accused of dropping this out of the blue, I refer to:
<a href="http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/presidential-update-war-games-1024687/1/20" target="_blank">http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/pres[..]1/20</a>
<a href="http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/presidential-update-day-720-1026120/1/20" target="_blank">http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/pres[..]1/20</a>
<a href="http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/presidential-update-full-disclosure-1026802/1/20" target="_blank">http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/pres[..]1/20</a>
I believe that this is an adequate time with which to research a proposal. You said 'Training wars are a big part of this comprehensive strategy'. I would go further still and say they are fundamental. Any issues the Dail members had with proposal should have already been discussed.
patton stated that he had spoken to President Woldy about this matter and was confident that there would be no reprisal from the eUK. Anyone that needed more reassurance could have taken it upon themselves to seek them. The president of eUK shouldn't be required to make a public service announcement here. Potential economic impact should already have been discussed. Everyone is free to ask questions, Dail members need to do it before voting day!
And 'Old Dog' patton deserves a little more faith
We looked forward to the new training initiatives you've mentioned here. But while we look forward to these longer term schemes, we need action today. I hope in future due process can be streamlined to avoid internationally embarrassing situations like this.
I know you will always do what you think is best for eIreland Edana.
o7
But the newbies need their war games...
Thanks for the clarification Edana.
@ Sweet It's one thing to say 'We'll be getting war games'. It's quite another to organise them and negotiate the terms of them. The vote had already begun before the contract had even been presented.
@Sweetie Ah! *claps in delight* Question authority. Beautiful! I love it when people think for themselves.
Duly noted and respected.
However, I haven't accused President Patton of anything.
*sigh*
Let me put it this way. If you are making a proposal, and a question is asked, is it the responsibility of the group to find the answer or is it the presenter's responsibility? If you, the presenter, didn't answer the question, don't be surprised if you get a "no" for an answer. It's not an accusation, it's how things work.
And yes, I know the noobs need their war games, youngun. I was Minister of New Citizens for two terms.
Remember what I said, things are rarely as simple as they appear.
@pdiddy Thank you. I did not know that option existed.
Actually Edana, I'm Deputy for the Minister of New Citizens.
When I say THE newbs need their wargames,
I mean MY newbs need their wargames lol
I like your analogy, but everyone knew who patton was negotiating with, what countries and issues were involved. If you know you have an important decision to make it is your responsibility to make yourself as informed as possible before it comes time to decide. Pdiddy's comment illustrates this perfectly:
You're not the MoF so it may not be your thing, but the fact that business owners can donate their RM's to circumvent embargoes was news to you. It should not have been, as that issue was pertinent.
I agree that important decisions should not be rushed, however every effort should be made to expedite the process. Else wise when an emergency does eventually befall us we will not have the capability to make decisive action in time.
The bureaucracy is expanding to meet the needs of the expanding bureaucracy -author unknown-
Still think you rock tho
I agree fully Edana. If we were to host a TW we would be painting a red circle on Ireland. And PEACE would come. They are trying to take out training wars. So if we host one it would be Mutually Assured Destruction for Ireland, and for the country attacking (most likely the UK, it would be destroyed because of EDEN retaliation)
Mutually
Assured
Destruction?
That's MAD!
Seriously though, what could UK profit by invading us atm? You said yourself that EDEN would flatten them. Obviously you don't put a lot of stock in the Raleigh Treaty, but would UK invite EDEN over for a banquet? Also PEACE seems somewhat occupied with hemorrhaging allies. Wouldn't Ireland be a gold dump for them?
I'm not arguing here, I would like you to explain please.
Thank you for explaining your position Edana.
Great Article Edana
If I was still in Congress I would have voted no for the same reasons. I'm sure a new vote, if the Americians are willing to give us a second chance that is, will pass but It was all a bit too gung-ho the first time around.
Edana is wise
@Pip Your assessment is correct. And yes, I do believe there will be a second vote, and I am fairly certain it will have a different outcome.
@Sweetie You know as well as I do that there is a lot to this game. There is no manual to look these things up. You learn as situations arise.
You weren't there, Sweetie. You quite possibly would have done I did.
“Unreasonable haste is the direct road to error.” Moliere
This was not a case of beauracracy for beauracracy's sake. I was not willing to make us a target, unless certain questions were answered. It was not a matter of dragging out the process. It has now become a much LONGER process because it wasn't done correctly the first time.
Let's just say that the lesson here is to make sure questions are addressed prior to putting this to vote. As Digits said, we hadn't even seen the contract before this was put up for vote. Don't you think that's a critical piece to have? That's not something I can just waltz in and ask for, that had to come from the President. And no two contracts are the same. What if there had been something in there that could have hurt Ireland? The President is not infallible. Although, it seems that way at times.
You aren't going to win this argument with me. lol Although I am enjoying this exchange.
'The vote had already begun before the contract had even been presented.'
If that is the case I myself would have most likely voted no. Over such a big issue like this I thought the vote had actually come very early comparing it to the time when Patton formely announced his proposal to the citizens of eIreland.
"For those of you who have chosen petty insults to honest debate, I know who you are. You have not escaped my notice. "
.
Hmm, well I am not sure if that is aimed at me or not, considering the influx of spite-mail I got from others following my rant on pattons article. However, I did not get one from you.
I am also aware that you respect DT, and agree with many of his opinions . Remember he was "MY noob" , and I taught him much, before he ran along himself, but on a parallel track.
So, all I will say Edana, is that you are a strong woman, and an independent thinker. There is always more to learn in this game, as the eWorld shifts rapidly beneath our feet, on an hourly basis.
.
I hope that eIreland will not suck the life-blood from you too, with its dreadful paralysis and blind optimism, and its tendency to bury itself in home-grown infighting and over-complex legislation.
.
Here's a sobering thought.
You are ALL AWARE, right, that there is NO LAW MODULE, in this game? Apart from vote/medal? I mean, that's TOTALLY IT?????
So yeah, from a game mechanic point of view, there's kinda a BIG /FACEPALM here for Ireland?
.
Anyway, no doubt the "Grainne-Rant as Cassandra" fog will fall over my comments again, as it does, every time.
.
So, keep working your cute little a** off, sister, and if you ever get fed-up over there? I mean, just TIRED OF KILLING YOURSELF FOR NO RESULT?
Call me.
Yeah yeah, I was the one who e-ran away with a bunch of HOT e-sexy Italian FMs, Renaissance Men, with a self-sufficient military stance......and has been having the time of her life.
And guess what? There are plenty to share
*high-five* Lady, oooh yeaah.
I'm not arguing Edana, I'm discussing policy
Rather than wait for the contract to be forwarded, then discuss it, then research it, then augment it, then discuss it again, then finally vote upon it.
Couldn't an upcoming proposal be researched, discussed, & the requirements forwarded to the proposer, so that it could be drafted as required the first time?
Then patton would know what items he needed to negotiate for on the contract.
Might you're input have been an asset to him? (& the nation)
Why the lack of pro-activity here?
Can't everyone work together?
Do not put off till tomorrow, what you can do today
@Grainne Hell, no I wasn't talking about you.
@Sweetie That's usually how it goes. It wasn't a matter of procrastination. Nope. Just the steps were out of order. You are making this seem like a bigger problem than what it actually was. If policy was followed then there wouldn't have been a problem.
Don't put the cart before the horse.
You make it sound like the TD's are a bunch of laggerts who are unconcerned with the needs of the citizens. And that we are opposing Patton for the sake of opposition. Surely you don't believe that.
Again, Sweetie, you aren't going to win this "discussion".
Thanks again for coming forward on you decision.
I was only attempting to 'win' answers.
You are correct, I have failed.
I will seek no more answers from you regarding this matter.
I want pictures!
@Sweetie And I gave you an answer.
Looking at that last sentence though, I could see where it could be taken wrong. It came off as annoyed, when in reality I'm amused by the choice of words. I hope you didn't take it as hostile.
List of all eRepublik Forums and IRC Channels.
A very useful reference.
<a href="http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/international-forum-amp-irc-reference-1032256/1/20" target="_blank">http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/inte[..]1/20</a>
Enjoy,
voted
I'm not sure I want war in my backyard, training or otherwise. I also would really like to know how many of our companies rely on US imports, like grain. I know Gonzo's Irish Stout (a company I work for) does, and also consistently has the cheapest 3 quality food on the market, by as much as ten, twenty cents at times. You can guarantee that price would go up if Gonzo was forced to shop elsewhere, and I wonder how many other people would suffer.
@Aindriahn : The last time our market fell by 35% when we had Wargames with eUS. Our market is fine now but its very big at the moment but Ireland is set up as an exporter if you take that away you Companies will suffer.
The only good thing about wargames with eUS is that we get high wellness and better production in Companies and Damage to increase our Miltary Strenght but not good for our Exporters.
>>>For those of you who have chosen petty insults to honest debate, I know who you are. You have not escaped my notice.
Uh oh.
@George Barker: Don't worry I hide you somewhere safe
lol
Safe?
I dooooon't thiiiink so.