What's Wrong with the Serbian Economy
New Faustian Man
Serbia for 96-97% of the last two years have been the strongest country in this game, and yet have never enjoyed the economic bonuses to go along with having the strongest military in the e-world. Poland (minus a couple blips) have had almost constant 10/10 bonuses for close to two years. Brazil, Spain and even the eUS have enjoyed similar success, success that probably dwarfs that of eSerbia – yet all three countries are militarily much weaker than eSerbia.
The daily damage output of Serbia/Poland/USA/Spain/Brazil
The problem is Serbia’s difficulty at maintaining full economic bonuses. And the reason for this difficulty is the manner in which Serbia is strung out across southern Europe, at the mercy of numerous countries and possible resistance wars.
To reach full bonuses requires Serbia invade and hold down some or all regions of the following countries:
As you can see, these countries can do almost 20 Billion worth of damage on any given day
Forced to hold all these countries down ensures whatever advantage Serbia have by being the strongest country in the game is almost entirely negated. And none of this takes into account the border Serbia get through taking possession of the French region Aquitaine. This gives Serbia a border with a country rabidly opposed to it which, combined with the damage of other countries, means Serbia are always at the mercy of a well-coordinated mass attack by enemies which can easily strip them of their bonuses.
The eUS-Polish NAP and its Impact on Serbia and the Serbian Economy
If we contrast the eSerbian predicament with the Polish:
We see that the Poles comfortably cover most of mainland Europe, now entirely wiping Netherlands, France and large parts of Germany (Belgium too but that’s part of a TW). They also hold an eUK region to defend against a possible eUS attack against the eUK.
This is yesterday’s damage output for the three countries Poland holds down to achieve its bonuses:
France-Germany-Netherlands dropped nearly 7.5Billion yesterday, next to Poland’s 16 nearly 17Billion per day – that’s a drop in the ocean.
With the potential renewal of the eUS-Polish NAP, we’re going to see a general cease-fire by official military units of the eUS and Poland from fighting against eachother (something that will probably extend to Spain as well). This will force Germany and France to commit to negotiations with Poland to secure some core regions – a state of affairs we’ve had pretty much since the collapse of TERRA anyway, and that's looking like it might continue indefinitely.
This NAP, ensuring as it does an end to hostilities between Poland and the eUS, means that the eUS will be able to concentrate all their firepower against their favorite obsession: eSerbia. This will most likely materialise as a direct attack on Aquitaine to regain Rubber for the eUS economy and wholesale support of Albania, Croat and Italian resistance wars against Serbia.
We’ve recently seen the eSerb economy stripped bare due to well co-ordinated strikes by CoT and fellow-travellers Croatia and Brazil. The question is: are we heading into the winter with a eUS-Poland NAP just round the corner and 8 months of eUS-led attacks against the Serbian economy? All the ingredients are there, that’s for sure. We’ve witnessed increased goodwill between Spain and the eUS for the last year, which has pretty much meant the official government forces of each country have a no-fire policy. Is this about to extend to Poland as well, so that we see only lukewarm support of Serbia when the eUS launch their attacks?
A Solution
The obvious solution is to reach some sort of amicable agreement with those countries which neighbour Serbia, and from which it sources some of its resources. But such a scenario seems fraught with difficulty, we’re talking possibly five treaties, at least three of which would be with countries eSerbia have had dire relations with going back years.
I have another solution in mind though.
Serbia and Poland absorb an immense amount of regions in order to achieve a full bonus economy, especially Poland, this not only fulfils the objective of robbing enemy nations of both regions and bonuses, it also retards the growth of many allied countries, the traditional ones of Hungary, Slovenia, Lithuania, and the new ones Romania, Greece and Ukraine.
You might think the addition of a couple bonuses to a nation’s economy would make only an incremental difference to their damage output, but the correlation is often much more extreme than that. With Serbia and Poland locked in Europe means the natural growth of other TWO states is permanently stunted. Add to that the deficiency of TWO power in the Southern Hemisphere/Asia/Pacific region and you start to see the problem. Is the solution then for one of the TWO powerhouses moving to the Southern Hemisphere, thus freeing up European territories for TWO allies whilst at the same time tapping the huge resources in the Southern Hemisphere?
The above graphic illustrates a great potential base for one of the TWO powerhouses (Serbia/Poland/Greece) in the Southern hemisphere
South Africa is a resource-rich hub, its indigenous regions are:
N. Cape > Saltpeter
W. Cape > Aluminium
E. Cape > Deer
KwaZulu Natal > Cattle
Free State > Aluminium
NW Province > Saltpeter
Mpumalanga > Cattle
Limpopo > Fruits
Gauteng > Fruits
And South Africa also gives onto South America and Oceania, allowing both for easy 10/10s and some interesting wars down there. I think only Serbia, Poland or maybe Greece have the power to hold onto eSouth Africa against the full might of BrUSA, considering the difficulty of facing the latter in their night-time hours.
The New Set-up in Europe
A Europe without Poland or Serbia would open the door for a much more balanced conflict between TWO and CoT (or the latter’s successor alliance). Russia/Germany/France/Asgard would be looking to capitalize on a Poland-less Europe, as would the many countries under Serbian control in the Balkans, leading to the outbreak of some interesting conflicts.
TWO do claim (fallaciously at present) that the “world belongs to them”, when in reality they have about 90% of Europe for most of the year, and that’s all. Since when did 90% of Europe constitute the “world”? A second, more serious point, and like I’ve said above: Poland holding much of mainland Europe hinders the development of the economies of other TWO states in the region by hogging bonuses -- so were either Poland or Serbia, preferably Poland, to move to the Southern Hemisphere, would allow Romania/Hungary/Slovenia/Ukraine and the UK to move into interior Europe, taking up the slack of regions vacated by Poland, absorbing the bonuses in the process, greatly increasing the power of TWO and states allied with it as some of the mid-sized (by TWO-standards) and smaller countries are able to give their economies a huge boost.
It would also nix the present state-of-affairs where the eUS is bordered by TWO "enemy states" (Spain/Poland) that it shares NAPs with, to one where the eUS is bordered by a plethora of real enemy states, including (via France) potentially Slovenia, Romania, Hungary, Ukraine etc.
This move although it might seem to weaken TWO in Europe, increases its power elsewhere, and replacing Polish suppression of Europe with wars between Slovenia/Romania/Hungary etc. against the eUS/France/Germany is a waaay more interesting time to spend the next 8 months than see Poland sign an NAP with the eUS and then stagnate on their bonuses whilst the eUS launch assault after assault against eSerbia. This new set-up would mean any number of TWO countries could march through France and get a border with the eUS. It could mean multiple TWO countries holding onto parts of France, effectively spreading eUS damage across a huge front, ensuring the eUS might face multiple NEs at any point throughout the year. And it would also deny the eUS the luxury (which this upcoming Polish NAP will grant them) of simply spending the next eight months attacking eSerbia and attempting to undermine the eSerbian economy.
^South African
NFM
To read an article relevant to what's been discussed above please click
SPAIN IS NOT A BOSS
Ty o7
Comments
First!
I rly dont care about ressources, all i want in this game is to see croatians and albanians out of Balkan, this is the biggest succes in the game for Serbia, and wiping out US worlds natural enemy ofc. Ressources comes and goes, but the glory of destroying ur enemy is even better 🙂 Regards.
meanwhile in RL....
this is the game. do not mention rl, if there wasn't nato balkan would be split by Greeks, Bulgs and Serbs like it was before ww1... (ortodox countries).
Kosovo Republik!
Someone took the wrong pills, back to the cage !
I'd ask ye to cite your sources, but hey..... 😉
For perma-wiped wee countries, its the lack of CS that's the biggest pain in the butt, the lack of bonuses just ends up irrelevant. As for alliances,(the fancy term for being a super-powers b*tch), well meh, in general.
Good article, v.
Velorted! o/
Votado maximiliano...
voted o7
v
Great article NFM and I hope to bookend it with my own later this evening
v
Not so long ago Serbia had an excellent chance to move it's empire to USA. They could have left their European regions to be deleted (thus moving their capital to US). All they would need to enjoy full bonuses is Mexican region with saltpeter and French region (that hey already had!).
So instead of being streched acroos Europe and having 6 or 7 possible RW's, they could have the same bonuses by only having 3 possible RW's (american, Mexican and French) which would be way easier for them to defend.
I heard the Serb plan to move their capital to the eUS was just a ruse to save face after the loss of so many regions. And attempting to hold down any more than 10 eUS states alone would have been next to impossible anyway, and nowhere near as lucrative as the present setup to achieve 10/10s, as faulty as the latter is...
I see your point, but I think it would require at least a couple more TWO heavy-weights to be permanently camped on eUS soil to make it work, the alternative would be the eUS and allies pouring all their dmg into one region/freeing it/moving to the next region, ensuring eSerbia are locked in a constant NE cycle with the eUS. Plus, it would be hugely damaging for Serbia to leave the Balkans. I know I suggested it in the article, but it was really only food for thought. Greece and Serbia are too important to TWO located where they are, Poland on the other hand....
Controlling 10 or 20 US regions is same as controlling all of them (neither Poland or Hungary needs them anyway) - only 1 RW is possible. So it's "easy" to defend, way easier than 6 RW's in Europe.
If Serbia left Balkan (you could get you original regions back later) it would really have a big effect on Europe yes. Croatia for example wouldn't have any problems being on the map in Europe anymore. It would be a whole different position in Europe.
Yes, its possible to absorb the majority of what the eUS has to offer by only taking 10 or 20 regions, but the eUS are one of the strongest countries in this game -- why move there and into the situation of having to constantly suppress the eUS when somewhere like eSouth Africa (which probably has only a handful of real South Africans playing) presents a far easier and much more interesting expansion of TWO power? Poland or Serbia could get easy 10/10s after setting up in South Africa, there's nothing down there that could challenge them -- and they could still hold onto core regions, or make it a nightmare for anyone to hold them down, effectively turning the tables on their enemies and creating huge drains of their damage.
Because you "like" USA and because you can 😉
Someone weaker can go to South Africa.
eSouth Africa has belonged to Brazil for as long as I can remember, albeit they're experiencing a bit of a blip now : ) But any TWO country that wishes to set up in eSA is going to have a border with Brazil, and only the strongest TWO country is going to be able to fend both them and the eUS off in European night-time. Greece may be able to do it, but they're too valuable to TWO situated where they are: absorbing Arabian resources and weakening CoT by helping to wipe MKD. Poland is the only viable country for this kind of operation, as Hungary/Slovenia/Romania and Ukraine can all work to fill the hole they leave behind. In this situation its win/win for TWO.
I have a solution, YOU (and other foreigners) GO TO SOUTH AFRICA AND LEAVE SERBIA FOR THE SERBIANS TO CARE FOR!
Nah, that doesn't really suit mate. If you read the article you'd realise I'm suggesting it would benefit both Serbia and TWO if Polska [not Serbia] headed to eSA. At least read the last paragraph of the article and inform yourself before making stupid comments.
Bonuses are not a true measure of success. If you ask me, I would never allow for Serbia to have full set of bonuses, until all of our allies posses at least half.
Holding own core regions and domination over surrounding foes bear great prestige significance.
'Bonuses are not a true measure of success'
I disagree, bonuses are real, verifiable proof that your not only stronger militarily but also adept diplomatically and have the nous to develop some sort of arrangement that guarantees you what you've won on the battlefield. Its something Poland secured with their treaties with Germany and France, thus averting the constant headache of RWs, but its not something eSerbia have ever enjoyed, which has sometimes been hugely damaging to the eSerb war effort.
'Holding own core regions and domination over surrounding foes bear great prestige significance.'
Lol, well I know your opinion of some of these "surrounding foes" Mare so I'll not get into that 😃, but holding down core regions for Serbia is, lets face it, a cinch. They may fall into enemy hands for 24hrs or w/e, but its always just a blip. eSerbia are so much more powerful than any country in this game that NO ONE can genuinely hope to hold Serbia down for an appreciable length of time, so I really don't see holding core regions as any kind of achievement. One or two may fall to Croatia on the odd occasion, but its not something Croatia can ever profit from, events like that are always just a means to score points, nothing more.
bonuses are virtual, bro ; ) you collect bonuses to fight better, right? so bonuses are not goal, but means to achieve better firepower.
it's output of power (not raw power, bh hunt, mercenaries fighting everywhere, bought dmg, etc... but power exerted in the right place and time, for reaching goals set by particular society) that makes a community strong.
then that strength is used to achieve goals, which vary in time.
i find it suitable to compare reaching these goals with high jumping in athletics. the nation "jumping over highest placed bar" is the most successful.
indeed, currently serbia has no higher goal than reaching 10/10, but that is merely a symptom of lack of unaccomplished goals and new challenges, rather than goal of even the lowest level of distinguishness.
Voted
voted
V
eSerbia have one more problem, beside all those you pointed.
We have terrible internal politic situation, and to much often thiefs in our governments.
These are huge problems granted, but I doubt (the thefts aside) they're any worse that what the eUS has experienced in terms of divisive politics. The official eUS military has recently been supplanted by an alliance of MUs which often goes against DoD orders, and this as a direct consequence of the shitty power politics that goes on there. The eSerb isn't the only political scene that's suffering.
Its also worth noting that despite the internal problems eSerbia has, it hasn't stopped it growing into the strongest country this game has seen since Egov stats became available. Besting even the eUS when all the TEDEN tanks had eUS cs.
It would be a MASSIVE shame if the eUS-Pol NAP comes to fruition and its a lack of firm leadership in Serbia that prevents them doing something about something that, on the eUS side, is motivated by the eAmerican desire to go after eSerbia and regain Aquitaine...
....by the eAmerican desire to go after eSerbia and regain Aquitaine...
Something which is unlikely to be lost on the Poles.
Good article like all from NFM!
It would be fun to be what you are talking about
Пољска мијења историју! Први део
http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/-1-2303992/1/20
Ajmo vote za trud 😛
Voted! 🙂 Thanks
votado)
Brilliant article 🙂 Serbia needs some strong leadership to bring it all together.
voted o7
Serbia doesn't need to hold a single Croatian region for bonuses, and in Serbia-US relations I'm not sure the Americans are the only "rabid" ones. Serbia is responsible for being "at the mercy of a well-coordinated mass attack by enemies which can easily strip them of their bonuses" while Poland has played a much cleverer game.
If this is true, that Serbia doesn't need Croatian regions for it's bonus, then there is something terribly wrong about this misleading calculation.
Croatia's core regions have the same resources as Bosnia and Herzegovina, Albania and Serbia herself.
Yup that is true but can you say that those same countries wouldn't put NE on eSerbia the moment they can?
Playing clever game is one of the things you can do but you can play clever game only with the cards that are given to you and you can't say that ePoland and eSerbia have same cards to play with....
A lot of how the neighbours behave depends on Serbia doesn't it?
How other behave is seperate thing...
Let it put like this.
ePoland and eGermany have agreement that is respected by both sides.
eSerbia and eB&H had same agreement that was broken by eB&H first time they saw a chance to liberate themselves.
ePoland has agreement with eNetherland which again is somewhat respected by both sides.
eSerbia has agreement with eItaly that is respected by both sides.
And then you have eCroatia that doesn't want NAP as long as eSerbia is occupying eAlbania or eB&H.
You can't say that it is same when it comes to ePoland as they sign their agreements with only countries they have interest in while those same countries don't interfiere how will they sign treaties with other countries.
You don't see eGermany interfering how will NAP with ePoland and eFrance going and so on....
Again eSerbia and eCroatia had and to me still have good relationship when it comes to NAPs as both sides never broke it while it was active. It is absolutly another thing that eCroatia now requires things that they just can't get...
So yeah you can't just blame eSerbia or any country that is around eSerbia as it goes both ways....
How other behave is interesting...
For example, Poland had a NAP agreement with Germany and France . While germans respected the deal french did not, that is a perfect example. So, later France gets wiped as a consequence. That's the way to deal with it.
Unfortunately I don't know anything about Serbia's agreements to make a comparison. I don't think Serbia have any agreements by the way, maybe that's the reason they have troubles losing bonuses every once in a while
They have agreements with eItaly for example and it was all respected by both sides.
Again problem is that eSerbia can't sign NAP with neighboring countries because they want to interfeire how will other NAPs go.
For example eSerbia and eCroatia want to sign NAP and everything would be ok but eCroatia wants that eSerbia doesn't occupy eAlbania and eB&H. ePoland doesn't have that kind of problems as eGermany won't request that eFrance is not occupied or eNetherland will not request that eGermany is not occupied and so on....
Do you know Serbs ?
V
Lovely read. I liked it.
Voted, didnt like the sexist image of the fit bird with nice tits at the end of the article though
😉
The main and ONLY cause of this problem is geography... in RL Poland, France, Germany are some of the biggest countries in Europe and therefore they have some of the biggest citizen counts of all european countries... the problem in eRep is that eGermany and eFrance don't have ecitizens numbers in game to represent power of their countries in RL... just imagine if both eGermany and eFrance had 10.000 citizens each - could ePoland hold their territories so easily? - IT WOULDN'T.. so instead of feeling jealous and some people even bitching about this matter (especially in eSerbia) just get used to it and play game... or go and make some large baby booms for eGermany and eFrance and mess up with ePoland's economy in years to come...
The fact that Poland has to suppress 7.5 billion while Serbia has to do 20 billion (forget that France is calculated twice here), what do you account that for? Sheer geographical luck? In that case you're forgetting that Poland worked long and hard on making it's 7.5 billion what it is today. It in fact did. Not saying Serbia didn't do that as well in it's backyard, Serbia just didn't do it good enough.