Statement from the Exiled Patriots of Canada
Rigour6
Note to readers:
EPC member Addy Lawrence has posted a TL😉
R as the first post in the comments section of this article.
"Recent Events in eCanada have shown the need for those of us who left to explain our actions to newer eCanadians, our former co-citizens, and our TEDEN allies
Let us begin with a little history: The following is a matter of public record.
In September of 2010 Rolo Tahmahsee (hereinafter referred to as “The Thief”) was elected CP of eCanada. Shortly after that, certain allegations came to light which, while given every opportunity to refute, he did not. (Editor's note: my own futile attempt to get his side of the story can be seen here.)
As a result, a motion to impeach him was introduced in Congress.
eCanada has an in-forum rule that motions to impeach require 24 hours notice, and the motion was put before that entire period had elapsed, so it is agreed by all that the motion was not technically in order.
That said, the Thief did not then, nor during the period of time during which the motion was being voted upon, reply to the allegations made against him. He was completely and utterly silent, until sufficient votes to impeach him were cast. At that point, and before the vote to impeach was concluded, the Thief stole the treasury of eCanada, including liquidating a number of Crown Corporations (government-owned and run businesses) and seizing and selling strategic stockpiles. The total amount of the loss of team assets has been estimated in the vicinity of 6000 Gold.
In the aftermath of this event, multiple attempts have been made to reconcile this individual to the community. A full trial was held, the transcripts of which are still available. In addition, many leading citizens made personal overtures to attempt to heal our community. A restitution order was set at 960 Gold, a fraction of the amount stolen, in order to facilitate his return to the community. A few months ago, one of the former community leaders who now numbers himself among our number even offered to pay half of that. Partial and conditional pardons were offered if only the Thief would express remorse or failing that undertake to cease acting destructively towards the community.
All those overtures and attempts at reconciliation were rebuffed. The Thief has instead consistently undermined the community of eCanada, repeating his theft of team resources when possible, and using the stolen team resources to bribe fellow players and build influence. Again, none of this is remotely in dispute: persons who doubt the fairness of this recounting are invited to listen to an interview conducted by a pro-Thief supporter last November in which you can hear the Thief describe this chain of events in his own words.
As I am sure many of you understand, online games lack any real sanction and so those of us who play them are forced to occasionally deal with an individual who demonstrates John Gabriel’s Greater Internet Dickwad Theory or fails to observe Wheaton’s Law. Repeated efforts having been made and rebuffed, those of us who see a value in building co-operatively more or less went back about our business, to make the eCanada community a functional, harmonious, and successful one. Don’t feed the trolls, and all that.
A few months ago, the Thief and his supporters, some of whom have admittedly been bought, others of whom just enjoy the lulzyness of the whole situation, began systematically taking over other political parties within eCanada.
This was a very harmful development for two main reasons:
first, it decreased democratic choice of their fellow players but
second and most importantly, having taken over these parties, they neglected or refused to run them in a matter which blocked foreign PTO candidates from running.
At this point the actions of the Thief and his associates moved past annoyance and became a threat to the security of the nation itself and its allies.
The response, by the narrowest alliance of pro-Thief supporters and those fearful that failure to capitulate would lead to the loss of the nation through PTO, has been a 16-15 vote of Congress to unconditionally pardon the Thief. This despite no expression of regret, not even a penny of restitution, and no clear undertaking to discontinue his course of domestic mischief/terrorism.
None of the above is in dispute.
We, the Exiled Patriots of Canada (EPC), are players who place a higher value on the community and its shared values. Our group are not dissidents by nature: our numbers include 4 former Country Presidents and leading figures in many Cabinets and Military Units. We do not believe a secure or principled future can built on this sort of capitulation. We note that every survey of the membership at large has indicated the membership at a whole shares our view that pardon without remorse and some form of restitution violates our core values as eCanadians who feel a shared duty of good faith to each other.
We note that to some degree Congress’ decision seems to have been based not on principle but expediency – that is, we are told it would 'cost too much' to do the right thing. After some discussion, we have reluctantly come to the decision that if that is how certain members of eCanada’s Congress see it, the only way to change their minds is to raise the cost of doing the wrong thing. Accordingly, we shall be seeking to counter the Thief’s blackmail with some whitemail of our own.
Until this pardon is rescinded our membership will, among other activities, be actively engaged in efforts to deny eCanada its overseas territories in the UK. We shall instead work to ensure those territories stay in the hands of our TEDEN allies Ireland and France. eCanada will thus face the ongoing price of loss of incremental production bonuses and repeated resource drain in order to continually fight to maintain and retake any territories in the eUK on which it holds ambitions.
To say we regret being placed in this situation is an understatement.
We understand that many people will not understand or agree with our actions.
However, it is our honest view that to allow this pardon to proceed unprotested would set a fatal precedent for the future of our nation. And if what it takes for eCanada to find the will to do the right thing is a demonstration that it is also the most profitable thing, well then, so be it.
We invite all likeminded persons, be they eCanadians, former eCanadians, allies, or individuals who believe in democracy and integrity, to join our cause.
We pledge to support those who do so with our full moral and material resources.
We will support efforts of remaining eCanadians to liberate their parties and return true choice and debate to eCanadian politics, provided always that efforts be taken to protect the nation against foreign PTO.
To be clear: our group does not seek to compromise the natural territorial integrity of eCanada, nor to weaken our allies, who should bear no responsibility for this uniquely made-in-Canada mess. If it is any comfort to our countrymen back home, we expect the damages from this campaign to take some time before they amount to 6000 gold, and since you were prepared to pardon a thief who stole that from you for his own profit, we hope you can see it in your hearts to forgive those of us who do this as a matter of principle and without hope of personal gain.
Finally, to clarify two matters: We understand that our efforts may have to be intermittent, as we will seek as best we can to sanction eCanada without weakening the broader TEDEN alliance – accordingly there will be times when military action in particular will have to be suspended while our members fight on greater TEDEN priorities. Naturally, any action against eCanada cannot help but weaken its ability to fight abroad, but despite that our goal will be to insulate TEDEN members from the effects of a dispute in which they bear no responsibility. We hope they understand our ability to do that will not be complete, and we apologize for any collateral effect.
Also, we are told that before this crisis broke, eCanada’s CP received RL threats which, combined with the stress of the present crisis, have led him to curtail his in-game activities. The person who issued those RL threats has no connection to our group nor to the best of our knowledge was he motivated by the present crisis. We utterly condemn the use of RL action by any persons for any purposes. We can have strong disagreements in-game, but that is where they end.
Long Live an eCanada which is
True to its Principles,
Strong in Its Unity, and
Free from those who would seek to destroy it from within."
N by NE Volume 4, Number 1
(Note to readers: I am afk for the next few days and so will be unable to engage in my usual enjoyable conversations with readers, and to rebuff crisfire's ongoing mancrush. No inference should be drawn from this, other than the fact that my wife and I finally thought the twins were old enough that we could risk a shopping trip to Maine. Y'all play nice now.)
Comments
tl;dr
"We, the Exiled Patriots of Canada (EPC), are players who place a higher value on the community and its shared values."
In order to influence the direction of eCanada, a nation we dearly love in RL, we have come to the resolution that "...the only way to change their minds (congress) is to raise the cost of doing the wrong thing."
The EPC will be "...actively engaged in efforts to deny eCanada its overseas territories in the UK. We shall instead work to ensure those territories stay in the hands of our TEDEN allies Ireland and France."
"We understand that our efforts may have to be intermittent, as we will seek as best we can to sanction eCanada without weakening the broader TEDEN alliance – accordingly there will be times when military action in particular will have to be suspended while our members fight on greater TEDEN priorities."
"The person who issued those RL threats (to eCanada's CP) has no connection to our group nor to the best of our knowledge was he motivated by the present crisis."
This game is about to become fun again.
"our goal will be to insulate TEDEN members from the effects of a dispute"
good luck with that
A lot of your on"neverletitgo"going arguments make 100% RL sense but not much game sense
let it go, those that pardoned Rolo don't hate eCanada....they may even believe in it more then you do.
Fresh lobster is on my bucket list.
cris: I know this may not be a common view in the present dispute, but I for one do not believe the difference between the two sides in this dispute reflects the fact that one side loves their country more or less than the other.
Is there some sort of mail list one could join?
"we have come to the resolution that ...the only way to change their minds (congress) is to raise the cost of doing the wrong thing."
- You're raising the cost of the occupation of eUK. Since when was occupying the UK 'the wrong thing'?
"We note that every survey of the membership at large has indicated the membership at a whole shares our view that pardon without remorse and some form of restitution violates our core values"
- OK, stop attacking us then?
Also,
eCanada: 6/6 resources 🙂
fair enough
have a good time doing ONE's work for them and not affecting the TEDEN alliance
Its a game and if this tickles your underside then have at it
Stop the BS. Move to Poland and become ONE with your principles.
Meh, If they want to spend their time and their RL Cash in hopes to cure their butthurt then have at it Hoss....
"Stop the BS. Move to Poland and become ONE with your principles". x2
"Stop the BS. Move to Poland and become ONE with your principles". x3
What happens when the in crowd does not get they're way.. Move on folks just a bunch of use to be important people missing the old days when what they wanted was what they got.... 4LIFE
I hold this group personally responsible for the RL threats received both past and current. I also hold this group responsible for the crank phone calls received.
I can not reconcile that this did not happen because of you. I hope you're enjoying yourselves.
I have nothing more now or moving forward.
I have no desire to hurt or argue with my friend AM. I understand that's how he feels. I just see no evidence to support that feeling being accurate. I've witnessed discussions of this group for a while now, and the only time any RL threats against AM have been mentioned has been when they amended their statement to include condemnation of them.
My understanding is the RL threat came from former AM friend Adasko's new identity.
Perhaps my understanding is incomplete - It often is.
Rigour6 your the ones stirring the pot to a very high emotional state in this game.
You're full of BS Acacia, None in this group ever threatened you in any shape or form.
Get out a bit and it will do you some good, maybe you will realise that the entire world doesn't revolve around you.
The threats you're referring to came from one of your pal, Adasko and the multitude of his fake acct, jhon Cleese, j lebrowski, etc.
@Rigour
Write an eloquent article explaining to all the eCanadians who dont really give a shit about any pardon or any of this but will lose out on region bonuses and ranking up faster because of the butthurt brigades attacks on eCanadian/TEDEN territories....assuming any of them are successful.
Then explain to TEDEN why eCanada is fighting to maintain UK territories instead of TEDEN battles
or just tell them your retarded and to lazy to get elected into Congress and make your changes the legit way
@E😨 My good man, I am continually amazed at the degree to which people expected this thing to go down so easily and now resent those who couldn't swallow it.
You gave a man who stole 6000 gold and took over parties an unconditional pardon.
I left the country, advocated consistently that protests should stop short of actual fighting against my former nation, and got called every name in the book.
I am sorry that you and those like you so badly underestimated people's willingness to resist what they see as a gross injustice. I suspected this would happen - I warned the CP in private messages long before it happened - and I do mean LONG before. I as much as begged the nation not to do this - and was laughed to scorn as a poor "butthurt" fossil.
To blame me for stirring the pot is bit rich. It's not my pot and I didn't put the ingredients into it.
But if your point is that I haven't missed many opportunities to tell my former teammates that what you're eating is poison, well then, you're goddam right I have.
The only thing i underestimated is the degree in which you guys are willing to fall
Does not this person live in RL Poland? Seems pretty bizarre he would go to all that effort. We should all calm down the rhetoric a bit. It is just a game. What happened to AM though, that is way beyond game. Stop spewing the hate. We have crazy people in our midst.
Chucky Norris...you can't profess to know what each and every person does with there PM's. You also can not profess to know what each one does with their phone. You have no idea what has been sent to me. But I can tell you this...there were and have been far more than J. Lebowski. Long term accounts Chucky. The phone calls however were the breaking point. Regardless...my point about you knowing what people do with their PM messages and phones stands.
@Rigour6 - "I have no desire to hurt or argue with my friend AM. I understand that's how he feels. I just see no evidence to support that feeling being accurate."
Unless you have evidence AM is lying I suggest you accept what he says. He received RL phone calls WTF!?!?! And he is convinced it is this EPC group that did it. How can that NOT be terrorist and bullying in any form? That is a line that has been CROSSED. Whatever empathy and commiseration I had after reading their suggestion of principled and reasoned conduct is G O N E!
@Cypher Rahl -- SO True!! I would add "self-important - used to be" because their actions have shown that they now think they are important because of their ability to pay RL money to affect a virtual game.
You buy your ability. How cheap is that. Now you threaten to be jerks.
Thanks for linking Wheaton's Rule. Seems to me unquestioned that EPC are purposefully being dicks, and clearly doing it as a real life choice, and now claiming to be doing it as gameplay. The only one being consistent in his gameplay has been Rolo from what I can see.
Go ahead and play the game how you like. Spend your hours focused on one agenda. You'll never again be part of the eCanada community no matter how hard you protest to be doing it for all of us. You are not liberators. You are not even refugees because this is of your doing. You are terrorists without a country and I would say any country that harbours you or from which you base your operations is suborning and facilitating your conduct and should no longer be considered our Allies. If the EPC is condoned for doing this to us, then it sends a message that any disgruntled "wannabe-virtualgamekings" will do the same to them or elsewhere.
I would love to see this EPC publish a complete list of their membership
You know, since they're so proud and all.....
Finally, I'm sick of non-Canadians lecturing us about what we should do. They should be banned from our forums. Unfotunately they can't be banned from commenting in publications but they can be removed from friend lists. They don't want to be friendly to our country why should we be friendly to them.
If they want to be isolated then we can isolate them effectively by removing contact with them altogether.
Acacia -- you've done a great job in trying to appease them while still searching for a way to resolve this.I am dismayed that almost half the Congressmen have not said a peep about these things. I am also a bit dismayed that EPIC - the largest part and majority Government has not provided a unified formal statement as well. They by law speak for the majority even though I also note that so many of these terrorists originate from that same party.
Congressional's are in 10 days. That is where real eCanadians will send a message.
As a United Empire Loyalist, and with a heavy heart, I cannot support the aims of my friends in the Exiled Patriots of Canada. http://www.erepublik.com/en/article/a-statement-from-a-united-empire-loyalist-1987485/1/20
Agreed ED. I think the trolls either forget (or don't care) that when they make insults etc the lingua franca of the community, there's always idiots who will take it another step past that.
To the extent to which my vehement opposition to the unconditional pardon has been seen by some as a personal attack, I regret that. I have, even in the present debate, for example tried to defend AM. I believe his analysis was wrong - I do not question his motivation. You can see my postings on SaraD's articles for proof of that.
When AM posted an article attacking SaraD, I upbraided him for that being an unhelpful contribution. You cannot see that thread any more, because AM has now deleted those articles. That's his right as the author of them - but I am sorry to see him do that. All that does is destroy a historic rhetoric which allows people in retrospect to verify what was said, by whom, and when. Without those sort of anchors, it is easy for debates to become duels of myths, rather than disputes over facts. Again, if that is the sort of roleplay people want, that's their right - but take a look around and ask yourself whether the present tenor of discussion is making eCanada an enjoyable place. Is your CP having fun these days? Set the macho posturing aside - are folks really glad to have former teammates now declaring their intention to fight a proxy war against the team? All's I can say is, it sure doesn't look like a lotta fun to me.
@Acacia Mason, then please, go ahead and signal us who these people are. I would rather have this than you slandering this group with vague accusation that could be thrown around all too easely.
I agree with your cause and I never accept that a good way to solve the problem with a thief and PTOer is to give him what he wants. To accept corruption is the first step to be corrupted.
Crisfire sai😛 "A lot of your on"neverletitgo"going arguments make 100% RL sense but not much game sense".
Maybe you didn't realized that this game is part of your RL. Corruption never start openly and at once. Before a RL corrupted politician commit a fraud against his RL Country, he needs some experience with illegal things. A lot of people say "shit happens" without realize that "shit" have had a process. The lose of principles can start in a family, in the school or in a game. If you cheat successfully in a Casino, maybe you will try to con your friends, and then another thing, and another....
To EPC, I agree with your cause but I think there are a better way to teach people in eCanada that the crime don't pay. The main problem is on political arena so I suggest you to fight there. Gather a team with integer people and win Congressional elections. If you decide to do it, you can count on me.
"As I am sure many of you understand, online games lack any real sanction"
There are a powerful way to sanction people in-game and it's a sanction that should really work with the kind of people that support PTOers and thiefs: Supplies. I tried to explain it to congress but to write "Unconditional Pardon" is easier than to find a real solution. I'm not an expert in laws but there are a lot of experts in EPC. I hope you don't find this proposal "nonsensical" as Wally said.
http://ecanada.cc/forums/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=16133&start=70 page 8
Without supporters, the PTOer won't have influence and the threat will be neutralized. There are objective ways to know who is supporting PTOers in Congressional elections. We can't cut the head of the problem but we can cut their legs and to end with the problem anyway. I hope I can help to solve this mess.
"Congressional's are in 10 days. That is where real eCanadians will send a message. "
THIS!
We will send them a message that there are many eCanadians left here that will defend our country to the last breath!
@Wombatman25: What a shame. You have the opportunity, of course, to elect the kind of Congress which would rescind the unconditional pardon and end the conflict. But that doesn't seem to interest you.
@jorge ''There are a powerful way to sanction people in-game and it's a sanction that should really work with the kind of people that support PTOers and thiefs: Supplies.''
Kinda hard to make that argument when you consider that rolo himself is WAY more than self sufficient. And will go at lenght to win election with the production from his ill acquired facilities.
So imo, there is 2 option here. The one we are currently using. Or the use of massive bribe to counter rolo's bribe. The latter option is not a winning strategy in the long term if you ask me.
I must be missing something here. If the EPC make good on their threat to cut off access to oil, isn't that in effect placing pressure on the nation through altering the flow of supplies?
Yeah acacia should make those who give RL threats public. Of course its much easier and beneficial to condemn us as a whole with vague accusations..
I see two groups:
EPC is saying explicitly that as far as they're concerned, there is not, nor should there be, any link between rl and in-game.
Those opposing EPC are attempting to tie the two together, saying in effect, that players should take the assertion that there has been rl activity and have it cross over into their approach to the in-game dispute.
Chickens, running around with bombs.
"I hold this group personally responsible for the RL threats received both past and current. I also hold this group responsible for the crank phone calls received.
I can not reconcile that this did not happen because of you. I hope you're enjoying yourselves.
I have nothing more now or moving forward."
Oh haha, you're paranoid, friend. You rage quit the presidency because of Adasko. Who, last I checked, isn't in this group.
If there are phone calls to your house, that is definitely over the line, but seriously call the police if you're being harassed.
I've always thought life would be more exciting as a bad guy.
From EPIC to EPC. Hoo-rah.
@Rolo
I am in EPC, put me on the list. I care about Acacia Mason and I am innocent of Acacia's allegations of EPC members.
There is an easy solution to this, Rolo must repent in a genuine way.
lol what a bunch of attention whores
Of course its much easier and beneficial to condemn us as a whole with vague accusations..
x2
so: too late for "well that was a bonehead move... how can we make it better"?
Missed opportunity.
Previously missed opportunity:
_______________
Are you guys just ignoring "the bonehead" or what? Having too much fun going at each other?
Rephrasing exactly what "was" said in his first chunk
-It seems like it's the pardon that is upsetting people.
-Rolo says he doesn’t need pardon, he’s good with just forum access.
Why are you even discussing a pardon?
________________________________________________
Previously missed opportunities: too many to list.
your accusation of us threatening you with RL stuff is pretty deep. Either come public about it and tell us who did this so we can fix it. Or delete your comment on rigours article, because to us it's BS.
I won't tolerate being slandered on matters that are absolutely not our style. we can be blamed for a lot of shit. And I understand we'll be viewed as blantant traitors. I'm ok with that. But I'm certainly not ok with being labeled in a group that is using lowball tactics to get people out of the game. ''
My question to the anti EPC faction is this:
Presuming for a seconds that EPC actually makes good on its implied threat to make you fight repeatedly to hold your oil, why is that somehow so far beyond the pale that y'all are filled with righteous outrage, but stealing a LOT of gold and taking over parties leaving the nation vulnerable to a PTO, that was kool and the gang? I understand the emotional roleplay "Traitors have taken up arms against us!" but what in principle are you guys defending? Your right to run a kleptocracy without interference?
It's like watching some sort of weird morality to me. You're the girl who invites the guy to stay overnight on the first date, but says "How dare you?" when someone tries to kiss her on the second date.
Well, you could buy that kiss with 6k gold.
gee. Someone has his head full of paranoia. lol.
lol @ Dr. Pain. But I am legitimately confused.
Maybe I'm wrong but I for one will be shocked if EPC ever wins a battle and cuts off eCanada from its oil. If they do that, I will say that's a HUGE upset for them. Sure they are big players and well connected, but they're taking on an entire country. So, while I know this action (if it even happens) is something more than symbolic, but what's the effect, really? A bunch of experience for the country.
eCanada is what number 30 in the world? Hell, the entire nation could be split apart by a civil war, it's not going to suddenly tip the balance of power from TEDEN back to ONE. This is the Golden Age of TEDEN, they are so dominant over ONE that TEDEN boredom is causing people to wonder if it won't break up just to make things interesting again.
I know people love them some drama, but honestly, suddenly this is the unpardonable crime when all that went before it was OK? I sense a lot of false outrage being used for propaganda purposes - which is fair enough, but does it hold up under inspection?
@Chucky Norris: "Kinda hard to make that argument when you consider that rolo himself is WAY more than self sufficient"
I know that, I don't talk about to punish Rolo. I'm talking about to punish the people who let him to have several top 5 parties. The people who sell their vote and give Rolo the power to mess the eCountry.
No top 5 party, no Congressmen.
If there are a law that forbid the use of bribes in elections, the people who support (sell their votes) Known PTOers could be punished. The people who sell their vote then will chose:
1. Accept the PTOer bribe and lose any MU supply for a period of time (I proposed a maximum of 3 months and that approximately could be 450 Q6 tanks)
2. Left the PTOed party and enjoy lifetime supplies.
It would be really easy to know who is supporting a PTOer. On 23rd, anyone can see a lits of top 5 parties AND HIS MEMBERS. People who realized that is doing something wrong will left that PTOed (or terrorist) party. People can take bribes the hole month but the most important day (when congress candidates are placed) they will left the party. The same could be done on 15th for PP elections, but it would be a little more difficult.
No top 5 party, no Congressmen, no more threat.
Gang d’arrogants qui pense que leur carte Visa leur donne tous les droits de décider quelle région le Canada peut garder.
On est pas de la merde parce que l'on pensait que le pardon a Rolo était pour améliorer les choses au eCanada. Pis, ça va être le cas, lorsque vous allez commencer à être raisonnables. En attendant, vos discours moralisateurs, vous pouvez vous les mettre profond dans le cul, parce que l'on en a rien a foutre.