[UK] President of Sweden answers
![Sweden](http://www.erepublik.net/images/flags_png/S/United-Kingdom.png)
Kalle Holm
As it seems many appear to have a lot of questions and/or presumptions regarding Sweden due to the Germany war, I’ve written this article in order to give You a better understanding of partly the war, partly Sweden itself. In this article I’ve tried to take with and answer as many common questions/misunderstandings I’ve seen while searching the world’s news.
As it truly is a long article, over 2250 words, you will have a register where you can pick and choose between what you want to read about.
Register of the article’s containt:
1. Sweden betrayed Atlantis by attacking Germany
2. What are the logical reasons for this war?
3. Background and explanations
4. Sweden’s timing is horrible!
5. Sweden has destroyed Atlantis
6. Sweden intends to invade UK after Germany
7. Sweden’s principles
1. Sweden betrayed Atlantis by attacking Germany
No, we did not betray Atlantis as Germany was not and is not a member of Atlantis at the time. Germany had 1 month trial period in Atlantis, I know that. That period expired 4/24. Since then no voting has been made to decide whether or not they should become members.
It's just the same as if you'd get a trial period on, for example, World of Warcraft. After the trial period you cannot play anymore, if you do not take measures (pay) to get a new play period. It's just the same with Germany. So no, Sweden has not betrayed Atlantis.
2. What are the logical reasons for this war?
1. Sweden's population, who have been declining for months due to boredom, will rise again as the game become more exciting for all players, no matter how much time they spend on the game. This will make Sweden stronger, and by that, also its allies.
2. Sweden will get further borders to hostile nations, which will strengthen Sweden’s and by that also its allies, position.
3. Background and explanations (Continuation of section 2 as well)
3. Germany brought this upon themselves. Sweden has, before this war, done one (1) hostile move against Germany. That was in May 2008. And even then we forced admin to give them half Germany back. 2 months later Germany had conquered Poland, and the Poles had taken over politically. Both the Poles and the Germans BEGGED Sweden to conquer it all, which we did, spending thousands of gold on it. In November we liberated them, as planned and agreed. All we demanded was Schleswig-Holstein (SH). In January Germany allied with PEACE to conquer SH and a number of still Sweden-controlled regions, temporary owned by Sweden to participate in the Atlantis operation 'Operation French Toast'. After that followed 5 months of negotiations, and Sweden was MORE than generous and kind several times, but every offer was declined by Germany. They counter-offered us SH for 5000 gold.
You must understand why my people are upset. There is no way a sovereign nation could EVER endure such ruthlessness, such arrogance and such lack of gratefulness. Sweden has always tried to help and be friendly towards Germany since June 2008, that’s 11 months if you don’t know, eRepublik has existed for 18 months. You do the math.
At last we lost our will to negotiate with Germany. We’d negotiated for 5 months. They’d declined all of our offers, which we’d spent endless hours on refining and adapting to fit both parties. But no, they declined. At last Sweden, who very much dislikes to be disrespected and played with, had to set down its foot.
At this time we had voted yes for Germany entering Atlantis on the trial period in good hope that this would repair our so tarnished relations. I have to be honest; Sweden did not take up the contact with Germany to try to negotiate again, we had internal problems that drew our attention, and Germany ended up in the shadows. But, none the less, Germany did not even attempted to re-open negotiations. Their wish was to ignore the Swedish conflict and hope that Atlantis would make it all go away.
In Sweden at the same time, the people muttered about how badly the Government had treated the Germany conflict, showed their dissatisfaction and raised their voices. I, who always had been one of the strong voices for Germany in Sweden’s congress (working for their coexistence in Sweden during the “occupation”, arguing and working for their liberation in November and after January, leading the negotiations with Germany), had run out of steam to protect and preserve Germany, and was quite pissed off at them myself, decided to listen to the people’s voice and represent them in my candidacy as president.
I succeeded; I became president of Sweden with open support from all major parties (except those bloody commies). When I came into Atlantis I instantly tried to get a voting on whether or not Germany should get a full membership in Atlantis, as their trial time had elapsed. Atlantis’ Supreme General, Shadowuks, blankly refused to put up the voting, though several members asked him to. He ignorantly said that Sweden and Germany can solve this diplomatic, as if we hadn’t tried our best for 5 months already. But, Sweden accepted his demands and opened up the negotiations once again.
At a point it was going quite well, Germany and Sweden seemed to have reached an agreement that would suit both parties. This was when I received intelligence regarding words from Germany’s negotiation leader. I won’t say his name. Let me quote what I got to hear, just as we seemed to have reached an agreement:
“As for X, I find it more likely than not that Sweden is actually going to get a bloody nose and after a few weeks retreats in ignominy, like the hopelessly declining power that they are. This is their last chance to make a big splash. Let them. I shall enjoy watching them fritter away their last gold.
If our proposal is accepted and X attack Y, we should sit on the sidelines and observe how things unfold. Then we can jump in on an opportune moment and get a piece of the action.”
Disappointed, enraged, ashamed and firmly Sweden pulled out of negotiations and stated that Sweden would leave Atlantis if Germany ever joined Atlantis. Diplomacy was over.
Could any of you truly blame us for not being willing to have Germany as our brother in arms, a friend you’d have to rely on to stay safe yourself. Picture yourself in our situation. Would you have tolerated all shit Sweden ever received from Germany?
No, I think not. Not when it really comes down to it. It’s easy to sit and say “I wouldn’t have done that! I would have done this and that!”, but when you really are in the situation, you’ll find that it was not a possibility, not ever.
I’d like to ask everyone who says that Sweden (or me) acts like “a childish, spoilt boy” to really take this into consideration before you really judge us. Please do that, or don’t say anything at all, I kindly beg you.
4. Sweden’s timing is horrible!
This I can agree to. Last week Atlantis took a devastating hit while it lost all of the battles for the crucial regions to PEACE GC. I understand that you think that we should focus fully on fighting PEACE GC rather than fighting ourselves through the Germany-Sweden war. I understand that point, I really do.
But, I personally find it useless to fight against cheaters. The battle of WSR, ESR, Podolia and all there was, was all lost due to cheating. Atlantis stronghold, Romania, was ripped apart by cheaters, and in my humble opinion: Why should we try to fight them during these circumstances? If there is no chance of winning, if there is no game, then why should we fight?
No, I personally won’t fight PEACE until the exploits have been fully fixed, for now and forever, and the guilty have been banned along with all cheat belongings removed. As this is, well, let’s just say, “a big project”, I find it OK to focus on other things meantime. For Sweden’s sake that would be to for once and for all take care of Germany, due to reasons you find described in section 3.
Apparently, my congress thinks like me, since they’ve agreed on dealing with Germany now. So, for all Sweden care, this is a perfect time to take care of domestic matters, until we can proceed with the global wars as they should be fought: without cheats; faire and square.
5. Sweden has destroyed Atlantis
I find this assertion to be both annoying and pathetic. Sweden is called responsible of the collapse of Atlantis. This for starting war against Germany, making the members pick a side. First of all I’d like to make one thing very clear: Atlantis’ moral took a huge hit after the losses last week, affecting nearly all active playing citizens of the New World. Romania officially surrendered as they refuse to fight cheaters. The moral is weakened even more. The members of Atlantis becomes worried about their safety, and they try to find someone to blame, someone to unleash their aggressions on, a psychological defense mechanism called displacement (you unconsciously take out your anger on someone who didn’t cause the anger). Romania has been blamed for causing the dissolution of Atlantis by surrender. I believe that is wrong. I wouldn’t want to play a game where you constantly fight against unbeatable cheaters. Sweden has been blamed for causing the dissolution of Atlantis by putting pressure on the members to pick a side.
First of all, all Sweden ever demanded was that you remained neutral, if you were uncertain what to do. We never sai
😛“It’s friendship with us or them, chose!” We sai
😛“We will punish Germany for their deeds against us now, please let us do this and stay out of our way.”
Secondly, I believe that an alliance should contain of friends, friends who are willing to fight for each other to the last drop of blood, no matter what. A true friend wouldn’t have to chose side, it’d be done automatically, without any questions. A true alliance can resist all the pressure in the world without stumble. Here Atlantis was put under a little pressure, and it all started to fall apart instantly, showing the real unity of the alliance, how weak the alliance really was.
If an alliance can’t stand the pressure and live up to these criterions, it is doomed to collapse sooner or later. Atlantis has experienced how weak its foundations are. But we haven’t collapsed yet. There is still time to repair this, to fix this. If we fix this now we’ll walk out stronger than ever, we’ll be The Dream Team with infinite unity. It is not to late just yet. The last you should do is to let the frustration that’s smoldering inside of us all out on your friend. You can either calm down and let the fire of aggression die by itself, either channel the aggression towards our enemies with renewed power, or you will see that our great alliance fall apart, due to frustrations caused by the cheaters that destroy this game so badly for all of us.
6. Sweden intends to invade UK after Germany
I’m sorry to disappoint you, but this is a false statement. Despite that we Swedes are Pure Awesome, we do have limits. Facing an opponent almost 4 times as many as us is just a liiiiittle too much, even for the strongest, most brutal Viking.
Sweden considers UK a good ally and friend. We’ve never been too close, but we’ve never had any hostilities between our two nations either. When needed, Sweden and UK has always been able to cooperate and discuss as equals to solve the problem we’re facing, may it be PEACE GC or who’s having the first beer after kicking the just stated’s ass. To be honest I’ve actually come to like UK’s president, after spending many hours chatting with each other, discussing the current situation.
So to conclude it all; Sweden will not invade UK. You can relax now, there will be no bloodthirsty, mad berserk Vikings roaming London’s streets in the nearest future. You may have to guard your president a little extra, or she might be kidnapped by a Viking ship while swimming over the Thames in haste, on her run from angry congressmen.
7. Sweden’s principles
Sweden is a nation who plays honest, by the rules and is always open in their opinion or intentions. We respect our friends, our enemies and every neutral country – if they respect us. Sweden is in general very tolerant, though we will not accept any offence without retaliation. If a nation takes disregard or insolence Sweden, we will remember it and avenge when possible, be it next week or a year in time. The same goes for everybody who respects and assists Sweden; we will repay you when possible.
We are very aware of the game mechanics, and we know how to best utilize them after each and every situation. Because of this there’s no coincidence that Sweden has eRepublik’s most efficient army.
Sweden is either a great, well-desirable ally who full-hearted supports its friends to the very end, either a respected, ruthless enemy who with tactics, strength and cunning takes down its opponent.
Thank you for reading
Kalle Holm
President of Sweden
Comments
ATLANTIS was a passive alliance for too long. When I was president I don't even think I saw all the presidents post in the presidential section. But when Sweden asks for a vote on a trial member everyone goes mental. Like it or not, things are at least happening now, and there are things to do politically.
>Sweden has, before this war, done one (1) hostile move against Germany. That was in May 2008
Disregard this entire article. You have NO idea what you're talking about.
Like it or not you did betray Germany.
We were promised Atlantis membership by Sweden in exchange for us paying off a debt.
Despite us making payments on that debt you attacked anyway.
Cite all the legal reasoning you want about the trial membership, it is a betrayal on moral grounds.
-Elisa Vorimberg
german minister of foreign affairs
agentchieftain lol peace officer coming and talking bs. gomsho
"The moral is weakened even more"
do you mean moral, or morale?
"all Sweden ever demanded was that you remained neutral"
still you demand too much.
Basically, you claim a region of Germany belongs to you. You have failed to offer an evidence that Germany legitimately owes you this.
They claim it belongs to them because they conquered it in the first Swedish-German war...
All that Germany is asking for is our sovereignty.
Something the Swedes want to take just for fun (says it right there in his "logical" reasons for war).
-Elisa Vorimberg
german minister of foreign affairs
>agentchieftain lol peace officer coming and talking bs. gomsho
I was actually HERE for all of the events he's quoting, unlike him.
Also, this isn't a matter of PEACE, even though I sincerely doubt either you or Kalle here actually knew the position I hold, let alone the one I held during the mentioned operations back in May. Don't meddle in affairs where you have no knowledge.
so did eGermany agreed to give you SH before operation burning spirit (or at any other time)?
@Prizma Jeno
Sweden had control over almost all of our land and said we could have everything except SH back, but when they stopped releasing territories after only giving us a few of them, we had to use force and Operation Burning Spirit managed to get SH back as well.
-Elisa Vorimberg
german minister of foreign affairs
and was the eSweden intervention necessary back than? Did eGermany need their help?
Germany did ask Sweden to intervene after the Poles TOed Germany. Of course, the agreement was that Germany would get all of it's original regions except for SH back. However Sweden had built a defense system factory in an original German territory (quite stupidly in my opinion) and there were some disputes because of that.
The disputes resulted in Sweden refusing to free our territories.
So you can see, Germany was feeling quite betrayed by all that, I have so sympathy for Sweden losing SH when we had to use force.
-Elisa Vorimberg
german minister of foreign affairs
its maybe a stupid question, but if their demands aren't that unreasonable, and they are in need of grain, and you said you was trying to be a good friend to them... couldn't you just gave them that damn region?
No such thing as a stupid question.
Their demands have been unreasonable, ever since the victory of operation burning spirit, they have been more like insults actually. Here is the Ultimatum Sweden sent us before declaring war:
"This is Sweden’s offer to Germany to repair our tarnished relations:
Sweden will be granted the following regions permanently: Schleswig-Holstein, Mecklenburg, Lower-Saxony, NorthRhine-Westphalia. Also, if Sweden later on requires, Rhineland-Palatinate shall be transferred to Sweden.
Germany will pay Sweden 200 gold per month in 6 months. This sum of gold is only a deposit and will be paid back to Germany after the 6th payment from Germany with 200 gold each month until the sum is paid back. If a RW is started in any of the Swedish-German regions and the region is lost, the deposit will forever belong to Sweden.
If any of the Swedish-German regions is lost to Germany they are obliged to return it to Sweden.
Germany will not be a member of Atlantis. However, they will be under Atlantis’ protection.
You've got 24 hours to come up with a answer, 00:00 18/5 2009.
Regards
Kalle Holm
President of Sweden"
We replied by thanking them for taking the time to write us a peaceful offer, but that it is unreasonable and we request one that we could accept.
They responded with war.
Elisa Vorimberg,
If you think that is unreasonable you should see the offer YOU guys sent us after Operation Burning Spirit!
If you did you would knew that that proposal Kalle sent to you was not to be taken seriously. But now you know how we felt.
as I understand that was a last "attempt" a day or so before the declaration of the war, clearly meant to be declined, as the eGerman offer with the 5000gold.
Its clear to me that eSweden is not so big on communication as they were managed to create the worst PR for themselves as one can imagine 🙂 (the ruiner of Atlantis, etc.)
But was eGermany doing anything to solve this situation? Or you just hoped that eSweden will don't go "that far"?
(I'm the MoFA of eMalaysia 🙂 I'm a Hungarian player, but I have nothing to do with the current eHun gov. so I'm just want to understand the whole mess)
@Ph Brodin
Our president at that point in time has a bad sense of humor, nobody seriously expected to get 5000gold from you.
@Prizma Jeno
We sent Sweden an offer at one point that would have given them temporary access through a few non-essential German territories so that they could satisfy their blood-lust on country X (from the quote in section 3) instead of us.
They then stole that quote off of our protected government board to justify a refusal.
We had a passive defense system factory in a german region. DKN wanted us to return ALL the DEM sweden had at the time which was over 80000. The reason we stopped returning regions to germany was because they demanded we give them a Q5 DS company for less than 300 gold as well as 80000 DEM, otherwise they would impose a trade embargo on us. Before that, we were releasing regions regularly, except during times of war. After operation burning spirit we negotiated to get S-H back and the offer we got from germany was that we pay them 5000 gold. Considering the gold we spent liberating them, and conquering them in the first place to free them from the poles, we found that quite unreasonable. So Sweden aren't the only ones who make "unreasonable" offers.
And just like AgentChieftain, I was there. I was MoFA when Operation Burning Spirit began.
@Algaroth:
and what about that "country X" offer Elisa mentioned?
Prizma: Those negotiations seemed to go well until we learned of the quote mentioned above. The person behind it was high enough within German politics to shut down negotiations.
Also, we didn't steal that quote but there has been a lot of leaking going around in ATLANTIS as of late.
Personally, I think most of you are a bit slow.
Just get on with it. Who pulls who's hair first?
We pulled Germanys hair first when they allied with SAND back in the beta because we didnt want to be locked in. It just kinda snowballed from there.
I just want to remind you that the ATLANTIS treaty mentions noting about trial members being automatically not-accepted if not voted on. It is here the whole argument fails for Kalle.
You should also see the impending problem IF the swedish population began to rose all a sudden. Guess what would happen?
They would (most likely) go after other countries as well, just to "appease" it's people.
And i must agree, the negotiations following SH were stupid, that coming from a eGerman as well. The 5000 gold were a VERY STUPID request, and I for one (i know i will get hated for this in Germany) was one of the first to ask why we didn't just give the region to them.
However in the following 5 months, Sweden has survived without that many problems. There haven't been any famine or other food related problem, so this "reason" kalleholm is giving you is just a farce, made to keep you from fighting for Germany's side.
And by the way, most should stop reading after: "Sweden's population, who have been declining for months due to boredom, will rise again as the game become more exciting for all players, no matter how much time they spend on the game."
This alone beats the entire purpose of this article, as it shows the real meaning of this: For the "fun of it all"
However Kalle is forgetting one thing: The chaos of the war module (coupled with the low populations at the times) which brought about the Romanian, Swedish and Norweign empires have now all but crumbled, thanks to the rise in the populations around the world.
Instead Sweden now thinks the same as it did taking Germany the first time around, that is not a political thing, but just "bussiness"
KalleHolm: You are a good guy, I have talked with you before, however these regions are not ones that hold up once one takes a look behind them. You know damn well all this is just to keep other former-ATLANTIS members from fighting with us.
"I just want to remind you that the ATLANTIS treaty mentions noting about trial members being automatically not-accepted if not voted on."
Nor does it say you are automatically accepted. The trial period ended almost a month ago and no vote was ever held. This is not Germanys fault however.
"But, I personally find it useless to fight against cheaters. The battle of WSR, ESR, Podolia and all there was, was all lost due to cheating"
This is so pathetic and annoying... he want to blame Peace for his deccission, becouse this not was true... LOL
Admins make the facts clearly...
1. Romania and Spain used the fake golds, not Peace this time... no compensation from admins
2. Romania used the daychange bug, not Peace... no compensation from admins
3. Romania got big "baby boom", whit fake/multi accs, not Peace, to higher the walls in Podolia and WSR, no compensation from admins
4. Indonesian fighters used cheat Q5 weapons... admins give compensation UNDER the fights...
So you can do the math... 3:1 for Atlantis in use cheats, and exploits... BAN ALL THE CHEATERS.
Otherwise, that is clear they just want that high grain region, and this is the real reason...
Hurraa! Ni, neo-nazisterna, har äntligen lyckats med det! Efter att jag läste #1. så skippade jag resten. Du försöker tränga din egoism genom alla små byråkratiska hål. Istället för att slåss mot PEACE så valde ni på den värsta möjliga tiden att attackera Tyskland istället.
Where is eSweden going? Vote MSAP!
Yet it seems Sweden wants to "treat" germany otherwise regarding ATLANTIS. I have yet to see that before Germany, that Sweden would treat any other new ATLANTIS member like they did to us in the last 2 weeks of: "You are not a member"
Had this been (china fx.) trying to enter, then Sweden wouldn't go so out of it's way to prove that it WASN'T an ATLANTIS member.
"You may have to guard your president a little extra"
We don't have a President.
I can't see how Germany's done anything at all wrong, Kalle. All your rhetoric asking if we'd put up with what Sweden had to put up with? Have you ever thought the answer might just be 'yes'?
When Atlantis leadership itself blames you for the end of the alliance, you may wish to consider they could be right.
thanks for the clarification 🙂
although the situation could be the wikipedia example of the term "unclear" 🙂
Germany played and cheated too much with both PEACE and ATLANTIS to deserve any credit. I'll not go that far to say that they deserve what's happening, but at least I will say that they worked hard to ruin themselves the best way they could.
PIG DISGUSTING SWEDES.
Sweden, is in the wrong. Full stop.
Loves
Lord
Shut up and go write your article
Rescue me? lol
If Sweden doesn't want war with the UK, why are the Swedish engaged in a SEPERATE war against the UK after signing a peace agreement less than a day ago?
And don't tell me it's the MPP's, none of the other countries are engaged in a seperate war
Interesting article. At least some effort has been made to state Sweden's position. However, as an eBrit, I am still more than likely going to fight with eGermany. Regardless of what Sweden has had to 'put up with' (what ever those perceived injustices may be), its present course of action is wrong, and will more than likely tear apart Europe, softening the ground for future PEACE activities in the continent.
Shame...
"Sweden pulled out of negotiations and stated that Sweden would leave Atlantis if Germany ever joined Atlantis."
"First of all, all Sweden ever demanded was that you remained neutral, if you were uncertain what to do. We never sai😛 “It’s friendship with us or them, chose!"
So which is it?